What's new

Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

Ange In or Ange Out?

  • Ange In

  • Ange Out


Results are only viewable after voting.

rossdapep

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2011
24,980
93,827
I
This was after Forest and Newcastle respectively. We really, really need to wise up to this. Injuries or not, we're circling the drain:

View attachment 150364
From November to recently I maintained that he'd stay in the job barring disaster and that the sack hasn't been close at all.

I think the next two games could lead to that.

Win them both and we kill any thoughts about getting dragged into a relagation battle. We can probably just focus on the cups then.

But less than 4 points and I think they see how we do in that League Cup semi final and if we win, they are going to have to measure each game and how close we are to getting dragged in versus the potential of winning a league Cup. Very difficult position to be in.

It's okay for the club to take a position that they will stick with him but once you get close to that danger zone, you have to act.

I do think that this time they are hoping Ange has any kind of turnaround because they really know they can't just put Mason in or get a temp in because in previous years Ange would have been sacked without a thought about the consequences.
 

rossdapep

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2011
24,980
93,827

This article is crazy. I know some will scoff at data and not want to hear it, but it's wild to see just how insane of an outlier our season is in premier league history and how much better the team's performances have been than the table shows.

According to underlying numbers and performance level, we're on a very similar pace to last year and should be in an absolutely comfortable position in the table, yet we just aren't getting the points our play has deserved.

The comparison to Klopp's last season at Dortmund is fascinating too. Shows how sometimes you just can't legislate for chance and variance in football. If the club is embracing the data model fully, they'll be seeing this too and no doubt it's playing into their decision of sticking with Ange further.
I read or but I don't fully subscribe to being unlucky.

There's a little bit there especially with injuries and some shite decisions.

In a lot of games we lost, we failed to create real chances though. Ipswich and Fulham at home. Palace away. Brighton second half. All games we went behind but failed to do anything of note.

I do find the quote about Romero and VDV being on for a 70 point season when they play together. Is that really true?
 

rossdapep

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2011
24,980
93,827
Actually there is a name that could work temporarily if we absolutely had to go there.

Roger Schmidt.

I would not propose him long term because he does seem to go down hill after his first season but he does get his team playing attacking football with more structure.

He'd be good in the EL too as he had Benfica firing in the CL.

A short term contract with the chance of some trophies may entice him.

It's better than Mason and I don't see Levy being willing to buy out a coach (don't think Iraola or McKenna would leave at this moment anyway)
 

Mark_147

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2011
2,105
3,726
Because a different manager will play a different way. It isn't just the players, the board, the injuries it's the tactics and team selections also. It's about how we only play one way, how we are predictable in both attack and defence regardless of the quality of opposition. It's about how we leave huge holes every time we go forward, and it's about how last night the answer to us not creating was just keep shoving more attacking players on whilst abandoning any semblance of team balance. Honestly I could go on and on and on, but what's the point?
It's amazing the number of times this has to be explained over and over again and still some people don't get it.
 

Mark_147

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2011
2,105
3,726
Wow, can’t believe people in here today. We just played Arsenal away and lost 2-1 despite A) having a massively weakened team and B) having a team with players who are all overplayed right now and in need of a rest.

Last night should have been a fee hit game for Ange, we never win there under the current circumstances.

Furthermore he has been asking for forward reinforcements and clearly we need either a new CB to allow Gray to move into 6 or a player that can come in at 6.

Of course he’s still under pressure, and I agree he really needs a win against Everton, but for me nothing has changed with last nights game.
Wow i can't believe we are 2pts behind West ham a badly run joke football club who have lost 2 fewer games than us decided to sack their manager because their board and fanbase thought the results were unacceptable. Meanwhile we think we should keep our manager who's doing even worse than banter club FC
 

Mark_147

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2011
2,105
3,726
utter jokers. A month ago they issued a similar update with the last sentence being that “there is an understanding that results HAVE to improve” well since then we’ve picked up ONE point!

Ange has somehow normalised losing for a load of fans. It’s just not good enough, every loss should hurt immensely but these guys are now so used to it that it’s water off a ducks back.
It's a cult.
 

sidford

Well-Known Member
Oct 20, 2003
13,190
39,538
Every morning for last couple of months I check in this thread to see if there was an announcement during the night or maybe Matt law with a breaking news story like he did with Jose.
I've never done that for any other manager. I don't even dislike Ange like I did with some of our old managers, I'm gutted for a lad who comes across as a decent bloke and has had a hell of a journey to get here so that can only be admired. Especially when like every manager before him he's been let down by the board. I genuinely just feel he's out of his depth tactically & in his training demands and at this stage have no belief whatsoever that he can turn it around. With each game that goes by his rep takes another hit and we become an even great laughing stock so why not just end it now.
 

knowlespurs

Well-Known Member
May 31, 2012
3,069
9,841

This article is crazy. I know some will scoff at data and not want to hear it, but it's wild to see just how insane of an outlier our season is in premier league history and how much better the team's performances have been than the table shows.

According to underlying numbers and performance level, we're on a very similar pace to last year and should be in an absolutely comfortable position in the table, yet we just aren't getting the points our play has deserved.

The comparison to Klopp's last season at Dortmund is fascinating too. Shows how sometimes you just can't legislate for chance and variance in football. If the club is embracing the data model fully, they'll be seeing this too and no doubt it's playing into their decision of sticking with Ange further.
I cannot think of any games where we have lost any we should have won , so to me this data is an absolute waste of time , look at the league tables instead
 

Cambridge Spur

Well-Known Member
May 13, 2015
849
3,019
City looking like they're gonna spunk C. 150 mill quid on 4 players in Jan and we're looking at short term loans rather than pushing/trying for long term scouted players. They must be some top quality players then if they can't be got in a January window. Exciting times ahead.
But but but it’s difficult to buy players in January….

Unless you’re a big club who stumps up the cash of course!
 

Gassin's finest

C'est diabolique
May 12, 2010
41,073
99,983
I

From November to recently I maintained that he'd stay in the job barring disaster and that the sack hasn't been close at all.

I think the next two games could lead to that.

Win them both and we kill any thoughts about getting dragged into a relagation battle. We can probably just focus on the cups then.

But less than 4 points and I think they see how we do in that League Cup semi final and if we win, they are going to have to measure each game and how close we are to getting dragged in versus the potential of winning a league Cup. Very difficult position to be in.

It's okay for the club to take a position that they will stick with him but once you get close to that danger zone, you have to act.

I do think that this time they are hoping Ange has any kind of turnaround because they really know they can't just put Mason in or get a temp in because in previous years Ange would have been sacked without a thought about the consequences.
And as usual they make the wrong decision, because this time they've left it too long and whoever takes over will have to get an unprepared squad up for a relegation battle.

Pure negligence.
 

carpediem1906

COYS singapore spurs
Sep 3, 2011
953
3,108
Question: how many of our current squad would we consider to be “world class”? And would get into EPL first xi or squad of the season?

Question 2: how many of our previous managers (who all failed to win anything too) had such players?

for Q1: I’m thinking only VdV, maybe. But that’s due to his speed and recovery ability as well as popping up occasionally with goals / assists.

maybe Deki too, when he wasn’t overplayed.

but that’s all.

compared to previously where we had prime Kane n Son, Hugo Cuti Deki n Bents to lesser extent (Conte), Hugo Toby Son Kane (Jose)

our squad is just not good enough. We need better players.

What would change if we only change managers? Maybe new manager bounce to lift us to 7-9th in the table, and then?
 

Cambridge Spur

Well-Known Member
May 13, 2015
849
3,019
Question: how many of our current squad would we consider to be “world class”? And would get into EPL first xi or squad of the season?

Question 2: how many of our previous managers (who all failed to win anything too) had such players?

for Q1: I’m thinking only VdV, maybe. But that’s due to his speed and recovery ability as well as popping up occasionally with goals / assists.

maybe Deki too, when he wasn’t overplayed.

but that’s all.

compared to previously where we had prime Kane n Son, Hugo Cuti Deki n Bents to lesser extent (Conte), Hugo Toby Son Kane (Jose)

our squad is just not good enough. We need better players.

What would change if we only change managers? Maybe new manager bounce to lift us to 7-9th in the table, and then?
I don’t agree with this at all.

We have got a lot of top quality players that many clubs would love to have. This isn’t a knock on Ange but look what happens at other clubs when a good manager comes in and gets them playing.

All of a sudden Forest have got an amazing squad, Bournemouth, Brighton etc etc. We and others weren’t saying this a year or two ago! The manager has found a rhythm and got everyone singing his tune is all.

It was the same with us under Poch. Yes we need a couple of top quality additions but the squad as a whole has a lot of talent in there.
 

sidford

Well-Known Member
Oct 20, 2003
13,190
39,538
Question: how many of our current squad would we consider to be “world class”? And would get into EPL first xi or squad of the season?

Question 2: how many of our previous managers (who all failed to win anything too) had such players?

for Q1: I’m thinking only VdV, maybe. But that’s due to his speed and recovery ability as well as popping up occasionally with goals / assists.

maybe Deki too, when he wasn’t overplayed.

but that’s all.

compared to previously where we had prime Kane n Son, Hugo Cuti Deki n Bents to lesser extent (Conte), Hugo Toby Son Kane (Jose)

our squad is just not good enough. We need better players.

What would change if we only change managers? Maybe new manager bounce to lift us to 7-9th in the table, and then?
So are you saying we have a squad that should have the following record in last 49 league games:
W19
D7
L23

So 64 points with a 39% win rate and 1.3points per game?

If that's what you think is par or even close to par for this squad then fair enough. If you don't then ask yourself why those are the stats. Why are we 14th in mid January and likely 15th before we next play? Could no one do better?
 

spoon

Well-Known Member
Jun 23, 2004
500
1,131
Fail to win against Everton and Ange will be off to a Greek island on Monday.
But if he somehow manages to cling on to his job, we will be analysing it for years as it’s very un-Levy like. Most thought that he would have got rid long before we got to this stage.
 
Top