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Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

Ange In or Ange Out?


  • Total voters
    878
  • Poll closed .

keithtighe93

Well-Known Member
Nov 1, 2011
1,039
4,717
2 points from Fulham, Brighton, Ipswich, Leicester, Palace, and Bournemouth is absolutely disgraceful.

Levy is the big issue, we know.

But it’s looking increasingly like Ange is a poor manager too.

I want to like him and for it to work, but cmon, those results are simply unacceptable
 

freeeki

Arsehole.
Aug 5, 2008
12,431
73,898
Well tbf even in their dark days they still won trophies which might've softened the blow

It didn’t, the United fanbase are as entitled as they come.

This pattern of collective behaviour from our fanbase isn’t new.
 

mrlilywhite

Well-Known Member
Sep 1, 2008
3,195
5,058
they beat city 4-0 few weeks ago?
A struggling City, yes. Let's be honest, it was an anomaly - not something we expect on any given week. To add context to your answer, just look at who have beaten us recently. We're not a top 4 side based on the fact we beat City by 4.
 

Albertbarich

Well-Known Member
Jul 4, 2020
7,323
28,255
I see people say this a lot but it makes no sense as a criticism.

Who cares? Even if it was every single one of us, it's clear we were all wrong, and as fans we're allowed to get stuff wrong - we're fans, we have no say in these decisions.

But for what it's worth, many were calling it out for what it was, which was just ok. I gave it ~6/10 myself and I'm happy to hold my hands up and admit that even that was probably too optimistic of a score.
This may come across as really petty but it’s how feel.

I care. There were loads defending it and yeah as I’ve got older I understand people wanna be positive but it was as clear as day that they screwed the manager over.

we have to , have to demand better from Levy. He charges the highest prices in the world, has built this huge stadium and thrown every commercial thing at it he can but every single time when it comes to the football he goes for the cheap option because he knows he can get away with it.

remember he only cares about fourth. Winning isn’t financially lucrative to him. We have to demand better.
 

noggen

Well-Known Member
Aug 21, 2009
1,820
3,766
'The new stadium will be a game changer for us. It will create revenues that we can invest in the first team and deliver success on the pitch - so that is a priority for us.'
This should be the next tifo/banner in the stadium.
 

ajspurs

Well-Known Member
Jul 7, 2007
24,267
34,006
We have failed miserably in trying to continue what we had. Not capitalising and pushing on after repeated Champions League finishes, title challenges and a Champions League final is much bigger of annoyance to me than anything Ange is or isn't doing. I'm still bewildered how we could let arguably the best striker in the world go and not look to in any way sufficiently compensate for such a loss in quality to the squad. It's fucking shameful and it's no wonder we're suffering from it.

Injuries are a problem of course, but quite frankly after that joke of a transfer window in the summer, we're kind of getting what we deserve. This club has nowhere near enough ambition, and a change of manager won't change that.
 

yiddo

Well-Known Member
Aug 19, 2003
563
1,197
Fingers crossed it doesn't go on that long.
can you honestly say you're content with our form and we haven't got a side capable of reaching top 4 if we had the a capable manager?
Wake up! this squad is not good enough for top 4, this was obvious the moment the last transfer window closed with us only bringing in 1 first team player.

Things aren't great at the moment and Ange definitely isn't perfect but look at all the factors and have a realistic target at least.
The performance was awful today but the team we fielded today wouldn't make the top 8 let alone the top 4.

I remember the day the window closed I was not happy at all, felt it was miles off what was needed (even more so than normal windows) but I felt like I was in the minority and there were plenty of people on here ok with the business. I said then that a lot of patience would be needed this season, this wont be the last awful performance especially with the state of our injuries but scraping it all and starting again is not the answer.
The reason our squad "rebuilds" take so long is because we keep getting half way (if that) through a project and dumping it, leaving the squad completely unsuited for the next coach.
 

phillipjpalmer

Well-Known Member
Jul 29, 2008
736
1,543
Manchester United fans have had to endure some utter dross in recent years, and yet I’ve never seen their fans turn on the manager or players on a personal level like we do.

Sure, you got the booing after bad results under ETH, but never have I known United fans target their own players or manager individually.

Doesn’t matter whether it’s Davinson Sanchez, Emerson Royal, Brennan Johnson, or whoever is next on the hit list - as a fanbase, we are spiteful and we are vicious.

And no I don’t care that lots of fans aren’t like that or that some of you are really nice to your mums.

Levy is a massive problem, but he’s not the only one.

The fans being applauded for travelling over land and sea, who are simply expressing their opinions, are a disgrace.

It’s a systematic pattern of collective behaviour you simply do not get with other clubs, and here it is rearing its head again.

The fact so many of you refuse to see that is a massive problem, too.
Agree to a point, that it's not right but shortsighted to say it's only us.
E.T.H got absolute pelters from fans and ex players.
Harry maguire got abuse.
Rashford gets abuse.
Fernandes for not working hard enough
Casameiro, varane all got plenty of stick from utd fans.

Teams in poor form always get stick from fans, especially considered "big clubs"
 

Tucker

Shitehawk
Jul 15, 2013
34,940
162,921
Mate, that was a shocking perfornance this evening. The worst under Ange yet, and there's much more to it than just inujries.

We honestly looked clueless, and the energy, cohesion and all around collective desire just isnt there.

Now I dont want Ange gone at all, but he has to get a lot more from this group and fast.

The inconsistency has been going on well over a year now, and it wont be allowed to continue much longer.
But all of those things have their roots in the context of the injuries no? There’s only so much petrol in the tank, and we are running on fumes.

I’m honestly not sure what people are expecting from this current squad with its current issues. I think people are being wildly unrealistic with their expectations that suddenly we’re going to magically become consistent and grind out results if only Ange were to change to a more pragmatic approach.

As I keep saying, the squad is held together with string. Look at how poor City have been recently and they have a far deeper squad than us. When you get fucked over by the injury fairy, it fucks you over good and proper, she’s into the proper rough stuff.
 

Saoirse

Well-Known Member
Aug 20, 2013
6,381
16,319
What, exactly, did people expect?

When he came in, Tottenham had two world-class forwards, and finished 8th in the league - under exactly the kind of big name, win-now manager everyone seems to want Levy to hire again. The rest of the squad was quite simply not up to the required standard and had spent years performing at a lower-mid-table level under multiple different managers. Our transfer strategy had manifestly failed, both in the frugal Wembley years and in the mega spending on the likes of Ndombele and Lo Celso once the new ground opened, with long-term consequences for the club.

Since then, one's been sold and the other is past it. We've made some positive signings looking to the future, combined with experienced PL players, but ready-made world-class players probably don't want to join mid-table clubs with no Champions League football nor any immediate prospect of getting in.

There isn't a cheat code, a "win-now" button. Even Man City, with infinite money, took four years to go from being roughly where we are now in 2008 to winning major trophies by 2012. There is not a single manager nor a single signing available to use who has any likelihood of instant success.

So do we want to commit to a manager who tries (not always successfully) to play attacking football, has proven he can get results but not yet the consistency, is happy to integrate the younger players? Or do we want to start all over again with another roll of the dice.

I know which I prefer.
 

Albertbarich

Well-Known Member
Jul 4, 2020
7,323
28,255
Agree to a point, that it's not right but shortsighted to say it's only us.
E.T.H got absolute pelters from fans and ex players.
Harry maguire got abuse.
Rashford gets abuse.
Fernando's for not working hard enough
Casameiro, varane all got plenty of stick from utd fans.

Teams in poor form always get stick from fans, especially considered "big clubs"
They turned up at Ed woodwards house!😂
 

fishhhandaricecake

Well-Known Member
Nov 15, 2018
23,435
59,063
Managers under ENIC/Levy who've been let down but then blamed because they've not won us a trophy or have failed to get us top4 or higher in the league:

  • Ange Postecoglou
    • Kane sold, Son's legs going, whole squad rebuild required, been given mostly raw youngsters and the odd mid table first team quality player
  • Antonio Conte
    • Expected to win the league with a back 3 of Davies, Dier and Lenglet and Emerson Royal at wing back
  • Nuno Espirito Santo
    • Performed poorly but given a load of tosh mess of a squad, likes of Bryan Gil etc
  • Ryan Mason
    • Asked to take over days before a cup final against Pep's City
  • Jose Mouriniho
    • Wanted experienced quality players, ended up getting the likes of Carlos Vinicius on loan, sacked days before a cup final
  • Mauricio Pochettino
    • Worked miracles whilst barely ever having anything more than N'Jie, Janseen or Llorente off the bench, never had the squad depth to get us over the line
  • AVB
    • Wanted the likes of Hulk, Moutiniho etc and was given a load of tosh, Bale loved playing for AVB
  • Harry Redknapp
    • Worked miracles with us, was allowed to sign mostly the players he wanted and he recruited really sensibly and well with a great mix of players, he also improved Bale and Modric etc, then when we were in a position to be in a title race and he wanted Gary Cahill, Hazard and Suarez he was given Ryan Nelson & an over the hill Louis Saha
  • Juande Ramos
    • Won us a cup then we sold Berbatov, Keane and Defoe and started a season with Darren Bent and Fraizer Campbell up top hence 2 pts from 8 games
  • Martin Jol
    • Worked wonders for us, then the director of football got changed, signed a load of players Jol didn't want, messed up the balance of the squad and Jol gets the boot
  • Jacques Santini
    • He didn't do great but he couldn't speak a word of english and the squad he had was pants
  • Glenn Hoddle
    • Was given a squad of pensioners and then got the boot
The problem ladies and gentleman is ENIC and Daniel Philip Levy, until that changes, NOTHING WILL CHANGE.
 
Last edited:

HildoSpur

Likes Erik Lamela, deal with it.
Oct 1, 2005
11,240
37,245
I clearly remember many were marking the window as a positive. Responding to the poster
We did sign some good players. Solanke was a good signing, Gray was a good signing. Odobert I think was a good signing but obviously very unlucky with his injury. We still need a lot more than we got but it was not a terrible window by any means.
 

delawarespur

Well-Known Member
Aug 8, 2019
2,463
13,999
We have to see this project out. And what I mean by that is support the manager’s vision by providing him with proven 1st team players. Not whatever the fuck summer was. I’m not saying the club should not continue to buy for the future, but solanke cannot be the only player purchased over 20 years old. No matter how good they might be, Gray and Odobert (maybe I’m being harsh on Wilson because he was getting PL starts in a fit squad before his injury) can’t be the first choice targets. If they were, then that’s on Lange/Ange, but I doubt they were. You can buy those players, but they have to be supplemented by players who can make an immediate impact. This injury crisis would’ve hurt us either way, but if we had more experience, I think it would’ve hurt us much less. Give him the next two windows and support him with actual ready-made quality. Make the tough decisions by getting rid of inconsistent experienced players/those with insufficient quality to make room for new players, and get behind the managers vision.

If he gets that and it doesn’t improve, well that’s a different conversation, but we can’t all want a project and a reset of the club, then lose faith when it gets rough in the early stages. I too am frustrated, but I’m sick and tired of starting over. No manager will be able to succeed if they aren’t given the tools to succeed. I truly hope that buying a high proportion of young talent is because the club see a long future with Ange, but the focus has to shift to improving the now. Because no other manager would be able to have sustained success with the tools Ange has been provided. Maybe in the short term (kinda like Ange did), but 18 months later it’ll be sack the next guy. Can’t keep doing it. I’m incredibly angry with the club for continually leaving managers short and then getting off easy by sacking them constantly. It can’t keep happening. And whether Ange is the one or not (I still think he is), I’d be devastated if we don’t get to properly find out.
 

freeeki

Arsehole.
Aug 5, 2008
12,431
73,898
Wake up! this squad is not good enough for top 4, this was obvious the moment the last transfer window closed with us only bringing in 1 first team player.

Things aren't great at the moment and Ange definitely isn't perfect but look at all the factors and have a realistic target at least.
The performance was awful today but the team we fielded today wouldn't make the top 8 let alone the top 4.

I remember the day the window closed I was not happy at all, felt it was miles off what was needed (even more so than normal windows) but I felt like I was in the minority and there were plenty of people on here ok with the business. I said then that a lot of patience would be needed this season, this wont be the last awful performance especially with the state of our injuries but scraping it all and starting again is not the answer.
The reason our squad "rebuilds" take so long is because we keep getting half way (if that) through a project and dumping it, leaving the squad completely unsuited for the next coach.

There is this, also.

Arsenal - to their credit - have stuck with Arteta long after many people including their own fans said he should be sacked.

They’ve let him build a young team and allowed it space to grow, and now they are a serious force again.

Spurs fans, if I recall, demanded:

- A manager who plays attacking football
- A manager who plays young players
- Prioritise the signing of exciting young talent
- Give the new manager time to succeed

Seems we forgot the last part.
 
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