James Mclean............

[Mouse!]

I'll never wear the poppy.

Flowers are for poofs.

 

[worcestersauce]

I may be wrong but I believe the main reason James mcclean and alot of Irish will not wear the poppy is because the proceeds collected goes to support the current British army.

It doesn't, it may go to help former soldiers with injuries but it does not finance the forces. I don't think the Irish believe that, they are just against anything with any connection to our armed forces.

 

[E17yid]

One of the reasons i'm quite a proud Brit is because of the wars. We all rallied together to fight a common evil so I normally wear one but honestly couldn't give 2 shits if someone doesn't. Each to their own and all that. I don't see not wearing one as a disrespectful act to those that died.

it's like all the BS the Mail tried to pin on Corbs for not wearing a tie or not singing the national anthem (which is bollocks) or not bowing low enough or whatever.

 

[rich75]

As far as I'm aware the Poppy recognises ALL those who died in war, from whatever country, not just British deaths.

According to the RBL website, Remembrance Day :

"is a day for the nation to remember and honour those who have sacrificed themselves to secure and protect our freedom."

Suggests it's only to remember those who fought on our side.

The day before Remembrance Sunday the RBL :

"invites one and all to join us in commemorating all those who have lost their lives in conflicts."

Mixed messages to say the least.

And then it clarifies its position here :

"The legion advocates a specific type of Remembrance connected to the British Armed Forces, those who were killed, those who fought with them and alongside them."

 

[Danners9]

According to the RBL website, Remembrance Day :

"is a day for the nation to remember and honour those who have sacrificed themselves to secure and protect our freedom."

This sounds very American, and almost like it's been tweaked slightly from the original purpose of the RBL and Remembrance Day to smooth the distinction between past wars and modern wars. Maybe that's the right thing to do, but there is a difference between World Wars 1 and 2, and Iraq/Afghanistan.

Anyway.. on the American theme.

There was a story by Marina Hyde on the Guardian website the other day about the link between NFL and the Military (about how the growing popularity of NFL in the UK is leading to more overtly military displays at sport...), and a Senate report recently showed that the US Dept of Defense spent $53m on marketing at sports events between 2012 and 2015. The report even calls one part of it 'paid patriotism' - at $6.8m - and the Dept was asking Congress for another $100m to cover the shortfall in paying troops. Hmm. Almost as if a lot of the pro-military support comes from sports fans (Nascar, $1.6m over 4 years).

The link I read is here, with a link to the report: http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/11/sports-pentagon-paid-patriotism-mccain-flake

 

[Good Doctor M]

McClean comes from a city where the British military murdered civilians during a civil rights March in which under British rule Catholics couldn't vote...

... Think about that statement. Consider his community and his family who lived through this.You think for a moment that Derry has forgotten about that or don't continue to mourn those lives. It's unreasonable to expect anything other than a boycott of the poppy from the Irish Catholic community now that the poppy has come to represent solidarity with all British service personnel and not just those who fought in the world wars.

I'm a British and Irish citizen and don't wear the poppy for the exact same reasons as McClean. The people wringing their hands would do well to consider the fact that particularly in northern Ireland the poppy is a symbol that carries much
more complex significances. Members of my family and those of friends were interned by the British military simply because they were from the Catholic community. The military destroyed countless innocent lives in the interests of "national security". My father was beaten up by an army patrol on the streets of Belfast when he was 12 years old. He always wore a poppy until recently as his father was a medic for the British in WW2 and spent 3 years in POW camp. The meaning of the poppy has changed and encourages now the blanket praise and respect of a military machine that has committed countless atrocities. So really, it's far from as straight forward as "McCleans being a walker"

 

[rhem]

I don't usually post but I read an article about a former British solider who served in Northern Ireland who supports McClean's stance. Was quite an interesting read that also explains in a little more detail why they have no reason to wear the poppy.

http://www.derryjournal.com/news/ja...fascism-says-former-british-soldier-1-7063056

 

[Misfit]

It's a free (ish) country. He doesn't need any reason to not wear a poppy, much less have a fairly understandable one.

Ridiculous to hear about the amount of shit he's been getting. Disagree or bristle with jingoistic indignation if you must but can it with the nonsense and wear two poppies if you like.

 

[worcestersauce]

So do we now accept that the Poppy appeal is only a British and Northern Irish thing and if someone is from or aligns himself with another country then he has no obligation to wear a Poppy, in which case should foreigners be expected to wear the Poppy.
Is it right that German players, for example, should be forced to have a poppy on their shirts?

 

[Mr Pink]

I'm Northern Irish and wear the poppy proudly.

And its Londonderry, not Derry

 

[Misfit]

 

[Good Doctor M]

I'm Northern Irish and wear the poppy proudly.

And its Londonderry, not Derry

Good for you. To each his own.

 

[Mr Pink]

Good for you. To each his own.

Good for me what?

I wouldn't judge, or even notice, if someone isn't wearing one and there you go with an unnecessary remark because I express an opinion which isn't in line with yours.

The irony.

 

[Good Doctor M]

Good for me what?

I wouldn't judge, or even notice, if someone isn't wearing one and there you go with an unnecessary remark because I express an opinion which isn't in line with yours.

The irony.

Good for you that you wear a poppy with pride. I don't care one way or the other what any individual does. Wear one, don't wear one, I couldn't care less.

And as far as "unnecessary" remarks go, I think your "It's Londonderry" remark was the only unnecessary thing said in this exchange.

Don't know why you're riled up here to be honest.

 

[Good Doctor M]

So do we now accept that the Poppy appeal is only a British and Northern Irish thing and if someone is from or aligns himself with another country then he has no obligation to wear a Poppy, in which case should foreigners be expected to wear the Poppy.
Is it right that German players, for example, should be forced to have a poppy on their shirts?

No they shouldnt in my opinion but could you imagine the shit storm if say Ozil decided he wasn't going to wear one. Far too much significance is placed on the poppy and not enough examination of the reasons so many men and woman have needlessly died.

 

[Mr Pink]

Good for you that you wear a poppy with pride. I don't care one way or the other what any individual does. Wear one, don't wear one, I couldn't care less.

And as far as "unnecessary" remarks go, I think your "It's Londonderry" remark was the only unnecessary thing said in this exchange.

Don't know why you're riled up here to be honest.

Not riled up at all.

I was just posting in the thread, you felt the urge to reply to me for some reason - nothing unnecessary on my part etc.

 

[Good Doctor M]

Not riled up at all.

I was just posting in the thread, you felt the urge to reply to me for some reason - nothing unnecessary on my part etc.

Not really an accurate description of this exchange is it. or was the "it's not derry, it's londonderry" not in response to me.

Truth is I didn't say anything negative in your direction at all, but you chose to react as though I had.

 

[Mr Pink]

Not really an accurate description of this exchange is it. or was the "it's not derry, it's londonderry" not in response to me.

Truth is I didn't say anything negative in your direction at all, but you chose to react as though I had.

I wasn't quoting your post, I posted in the thread...so it wasn't directed at you at all. Just where McClean is from that's why I referenced it, and even at that I meant it in a tongue in cheek sort of way - I don't give two hoots really.

Anyway, the only thing unnecessary is dragging this our further - so that's the last I'll say on it.

 

[Good Doctor M]

I wasn't quoting your post, I posted in the thread...so it wasn't directed at you at all. Just where McClean is from that's why I referenced it, and even at that I meant it in a tongue in cheek sort of way - I don't give two hoots really.

Anyway, the only thing unnecessary is dragging this our further - so that's the last I'll say on it.

Sounds good. Fuck this shit.

 

[ethanedwards]

Unfortunately in Northern Ireland loyalist paramilitaries have hijacked the poppy , it adorns their murals and shrines.
They try to equate their activities to those of a legitimate military force, but the reality is they are just murderous gansters.
A lot of the criticism directed at McClean is sectarianism.