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How optimistic are you for Spurs in the Twenties?

How optimistic are you about Tottenham in the Twenties?

  • I’m incredibly optimistic. We’re going to smash it.

    Votes: 19 4.7%
  • I’m fairly optimistic. We’ll continue to build and definitely win something.

    Votes: 131 32.2%
  • I’m optimistic in the short term but we’ll implode in three years’ time. It's the Mourinho way.

    Votes: 11 2.7%
  • I’m pessimistic in the short term because 2018 has fucked us, but we'll be fine after a rebuild.

    Votes: 101 24.8%
  • I’m pretty pessimistic. We’ve had our chance, we’ve cocked it up and we’re on the decline.

    Votes: 136 33.4%
  • I’m as cheery as Hank in the match-day thread. We're toast.

    Votes: 9 2.2%

  • Total voters
    407

Metalhead

But that's a debate for another thread.....
Nov 24, 2013
25,352
38,295
True. Wasn't clear from my post but my reasoning was also this:
Might be a bit simplistic/cynical but I can't see a sheik buying the club because of the Jewish heritage. Not saying that they would have a problem personally but I could see it become an issue later on, easily avoided by targeting other clubs. Can't see any more rich Russians getting into the PL so that probably leaves Americans. Much more likely to get Glazers/Kroenkes in that case, imo.
I don't think that the Jewish connection to Spurs would really play much part, if any. What worries me more is the backgrounds of some of these potential owners although I totally acknowledge that not everyone would care that much. I'd rather see us continue with Levy and ENIC - I just feel frustrated at the moment because it's hard to see where we are headed in terms of financing a team rebuild.
 

The Opinionated Lurker

Well-Known Member
Jun 9, 2019
720
2,554
Have to admit even though I voted optimistically I haven’t felt this disillusioned by Tottenham since the Sherwood days. This season or at least the past year feels incredibly hollow, barring the CL run. We’ve hit a brick wall and I’d like to think upper management can steer through it but I’m not so sure. Poch, with all his faults, had the carpet swept out from under him and it looks like we’re seeing that again w Jose. I’d love for ENIC to sell us but that day looks far away.
 

Bobbins

SC's 14th Sexiest Male 2008
May 5, 2005
21,548
45,031
If the reason you support a club is the aim of winning cups and leagues well we all hope for that but if it is your primary reason perhaps you would be better off changing your allegiance to City or Chelsea with the hope their Paymasters don't decide to chuck it in otherwise you will have to change allegiance again .
Don't you think all supporters of all clubs want to win things . If that is the depth of your support then if you decide to move on I don't think you will be missed by other supporters who stick by their beloved club thru thick and thin however long the thin era lasts .

This isn’t like being a Preston fan where you are only being asked to pay £20 to watch a home game - our tickets prices are the highest in the country and there is absolutely no justification for it.

It’s not about sticking with the club through thick and thin - it’s about the exhaustion and disillusionment of being perpetual nearly men, about being a club which used to win things but now never does, and being asked to pay for the privilege of watching the same players every season with absolutely minimal investment in the team in response to our huge costs.

We are turning into Arsenal but without the decade of success and regular cup wins to soften the blow.
 

For the love of Spurs

Well-Known Member
Mar 28, 2015
3,444
11,252
This isn’t like being a Preston fan where you are only being asked to pay £20 to watch a home game - our tickets prices are the highest in the country and there is absolutely no justification for it.

It’s not about sticking with the club through thick and thin - it’s about the exhaustion and disillusionment of being perpetual nearly men, about being a club which used to win things but now never does, and being asked to pay for the privilege of watching the same players every season with absolutely minimal investment in the team in response to our huge costs.

We are turning into Arsenal but without the decade of success and regular cup wins to soften the blow.


It does seem that way, if we had won the league and the CL I think most people would have accepted mid table for a good long time after.

It does sometimes feel that we are in a Harrord’s stadium paying Harrords prices for Tesco products. I suppose one good thing about going back to mid table is you don’t have the stress anymore of being nearly men. If we win a game it feel like a bonus the way it did in the 90’s.
 

dtxspurs

Welcome to the Good Life
Dec 28, 2017
11,234
46,574
This isn’t like being a Preston fan where you are only being asked to pay £20 to watch a home game - our tickets prices are the highest in the country and there is absolutely no justification for it.

It’s not about sticking with the club through thick and thin - it’s about the exhaustion and disillusionment of being perpetual nearly men, about being a club which used to win things but now never does, and being asked to pay for the privilege of watching the same players every season with absolutely minimal investment in the team in response to our huge costs.

We are turning into Arsenal but without the decade of success and regular cup wins to soften the blow.
This is so glaringly obvious. Sucks man!
 

buckley

Well-Known Member
Sep 15, 2012
2,595
6,073
Well stop going then if grates so much its getting on my tits complaining about prices the answer is in your own hand .
I believe that when it suits Levy he will invest but he will not be pushed into doing so by fans .
I also believe that Jose is no mug and knows that investment is needed and he would not be here now without some kind of promise of future investment . It may be when the sponsorship of Stadium /Training ground /Shirt sleeves / is all sorted .
It may be tied into the future of the hotel and houses to be built by the ground or the other site whereabouts escapes my memory who knows but why would Levy not invest thereby devaluing the club that everybody is so sure he is trying to sell it does not make sense you can call Levy a lot of things but he is not stupid when it comes to profit .
 

For the love of Spurs

Well-Known Member
Mar 28, 2015
3,444
11,252
For myself I am retired and money is sometimes a problem if I could not afford the price of tickets or did not want to pay the prices asked I would not go anymore . Moaning about the price of tickets does not register with me . If you can't afford it then don't go .If you don't want to pay the price of tickets then don't .But one of the reasons we are able to compete on most fronts financially is the reason we pay the ticket prices you would be a fool not to want cheaper tickets . I always think things have been really muddled or muddy is the coming of Chelsea and City because they with their unending finances have been responsible for the increase in wages and the increase in transfer fees .
Also in Europe with Juventus and PSG . Whenever you go for a player if they want them its a no contest as they will blow you out of the water if it comes to transfer fees and if its just a wage thing they also will beat you . So to some extent we are along with the rest hanging on to their coat tails so to speak . So we can compete on a level playing field with the clubs that are genuinely self sufficient but the Uber rich are beyond not only our means but every body else. If they are in trouble with FFP they just sponsor a toilet brush for 20 or 30 million pounds by one of the many companies they own and so getting around the rules that everyone else has to abide by .
I am still in love with spurs at the age of 76 and still have my dreams of winning trophies but with every new oligarch that enters the game it gets harder having said that if we can win something it will be the sweeter especially without financial doping.

76 great then you have seen us win stuff (league cup aside), your right it’s not all about winning but when we had the chance with just a few more signings and a bit of an extra push we didn’t take it. Happened both with Redknapp and Poch.

Levy has shown that he only invests on the way down not up, which to most supporters is a signal he is just wants top 4 and that’s fine.

Everytime we are close to anything you just know we will f*ck up and the whole league will laugh at us as botlers. in a bizarre way I am ok with us going back to mid table, I no longer have to get my hopes up for anything and can just watch the football as it is.

As for the ownership and doing it the right way. Well It’s hardly as if Joe tax avoider Lewis is any better than Abramovich or some Middle Eastern oil man. I’d love the club to be fan owned but it ain’t so would I really care if some Chinese businessman pumped £2 billion in and bought us trophies and great football, not really that’s the game as it is now.

We play in a fancy stadium paying really really really fancy prices for ok football in a fancy league.
 

Bobbins

SC's 14th Sexiest Male 2008
May 5, 2005
21,548
45,031
Well stop going then if grates so much its getting on my tits complaining about prices the answer is in your own hand .
I believe that when it suits Levy he will invest but he will not be pushed into doing so by fans .
I also believe that Jose is no mug and knows that investment is needed and he would not be here now without some kind of promise of future investment . It may be when the sponsorship of Stadium /Training ground /Shirt sleeves / is all sorted .
It may be tied into the future of the hotel and houses to be built by the ground or the other site whereabouts escapes my memory who knows but why would Levy not invest thereby devaluing the club that everybody is so sure he is trying to sell it does not make sense you can call Levy a lot of things but he is not stupid when it comes to profit .

To be fair I have, I said exactly that in my post.
 

Young Nasty Man

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
470
1,317
The irony of Spurs is we have slowly progressed forward up until this point, although it feels like we have peaked with minimal to show for it. It seems to be very clear that this club peaked earlier than expected and that caused to have inverse effects. What do I mean by the club 'peaking' early?

It seems pretty clear that from the footballing side of the house or the "product" side of Spurs, we signed an amazing manager in Pochettino who was able to get more out of his players than expected at a fraction of the cost that the other clubs. We obtained champions league more than once, increasing our ability to afford more or higher valued players, all while building a stadium that was financed in a very fiscally responsible manner. The timing of the stadium, the immediate incline of a very good footballing product [while placed between years where two of the recent better teams drastically declines (i.e. Chelsea, Man U, Arsenal all declined over a 4 year window)], and the cost squeeze of the owner, seemingly was an unexpected collision of events happening at once, causing us to peak earlier than we we're able to expect.

This club has been treated as a fiscal investment since day 1 of ENIC's takeover and management. The seemingly saw programs like Southampton, Dortmund, and other feeder clubs as a more profitable method than invest in prime players that can win now. So here we are with a well known manager, world class stadium, revenue probably higher than its ever been, with a terribly burnt out team -- the opposite of what we had the past 2-3 years.

Why am I pessimistic yet long term optimistic? I suppose that has something to do with the other teams I support (I am a massive Jets and Knicks fan), but more so having to do with the fact that our owners haven't deviated from their path. History has shown that the costs associated with stadiums and arenas can be too cost intensive for a club, and have led clubs to financial collapse. Levy may be a pain in the ass when it comes to increasing the 'pedigree' of the clubs results, but he is hardly that when it comes to the value. He won't invest or provide the club with the finances required to compete with oil or oligarch or chinese money, making this an odd predicament -- yet he also will not risk decreasing the clubs value. Most of this clubs ability to purchase over the past few years was solely on the back of Gareth Bale and our academy. Ryan Mason, Chiriches, Fazio, Townsend, Bentaleb, etc. had been the reason we had been able to spend -- outs before ins with a few exceptions to the rule. With Eriksen being the only TRUE screw up by Levy for getting the ROI required, I do anticipate we will be able to replenish the squad. It is only the club's benefit to increase the results on the pitch, therefore, I do believe we need a refresher. Mourinho is a winner and has a style, and quite frankly, showed his tactics can work and the Liverpool match show that. Everyone presses now, and he has the formula to shut that down.
 

shelfboy68

Well-Known Member
Jun 14, 2008
14,566
19,651
The irony of Spurs is we have slowly progressed forward up until this point, although it feels like we have peaked with minimal to show for it. It seems to be very clear that this club peaked earlier than expected and that caused to have inverse effects. What do I mean by the club 'peaking' early?

It seems pretty clear that from the footballing side of the house or the "product" side of Spurs, we signed an amazing manager in Pochettino who was able to get more out of his players than expected at a fraction of the cost that the other clubs. We obtained champions league more than once, increasing our ability to afford more or higher valued players, all while building a stadium that was financed in a very fiscally responsible manner. The timing of the stadium, the immediate incline of a very good footballing product [while placed between years where two of the recent better teams drastically declines (i.e. Chelsea, Man U, Arsenal all declined over a 4 year window)], and the cost squeeze of the owner, seemingly was an unexpected collision of events happening at once, causing us to peak earlier than we we're able to expect.

This club has been treated as a fiscal investment since day 1 of ENIC's takeover and management. The seemingly saw programs like Southampton, Dortmund, and other feeder clubs as a more profitable method than invest in prime players that can win now. So here we are with a well known manager, world class stadium, revenue probably higher than its ever been, with a terribly burnt out team -- the opposite of what we had the past 2-3 years.

Why am I pessimistic yet long term optimistic? I suppose that has something to do with the other teams I support (I am a massive Jets and Knicks fan), but more so having to do with the fact that our owners haven't deviated from their path. History has shown that the costs associated with stadiums and arenas can be too cost intensive for a club, and have led clubs to financial collapse. Levy may be a pain in the ass when it comes to increasing the 'pedigree' of the clubs results, but he is hardly that when it comes to the value. He won't invest or provide the club with the finances required to compete with oil or oligarch or chinese money, making this an odd predicament -- yet he also will not risk decreasing the clubs value. Most of this clubs ability to purchase over the past few years was solely on the back of Gareth Bale and our academy. Ryan Mason, Chiriches, Fazio, Townsend, Bentaleb, etc. had been the reason we had been able to spend -- outs before ins with a few exceptions to the rule. With Eriksen being the only TRUE screw up by Levy for getting the ROI required, I do anticipate we will be able to replenish the squad. It is only the club's benefit to increase the results on the pitch, therefore, I do believe we need a refresher. Mourinho is a winner and has a style, and quite frankly, showed his tactics can work and the Liverpool match show that. Everyone presses now, and he has the formula to shut that down.
Levy doesn't devalue the club because with season ticket prices the higher in the land ensures that the money comes rolling in whilst offering a mediocre product on the pitch which he has no shame in, In short he buys Buckingham palace but fits it out with second hand furniture and charges the tourist top price for viewing nice (y)
 

hellava_tough

Well-Known Member
Apr 21, 2005
9,429
12,382
The irony of Spurs is we have slowly progressed forward up until this point, although it feels like we have peaked with minimal to show for it. It seems to be very clear that this club peaked earlier than expected and that caused to have inverse effects. What do I mean by the club 'peaking' early?

It seems pretty clear that from the footballing side of the house or the "product" side of Spurs, we signed an amazing manager in Pochettino who was able to get more out of his players than expected at a fraction of the cost that the other clubs. We obtained champions league more than once, increasing our ability to afford more or higher valued players, all while building a stadium that was financed in a very fiscally responsible manner. The timing of the stadium, the immediate incline of a very good footballing product [while placed between years where two of the recent better teams drastically declines (i.e. Chelsea, Man U, Arsenal all declined over a 4 year window)], and the cost squeeze of the owner, seemingly was an unexpected collision of events happening at once, causing us to peak earlier than we we're able to expect.

This club has been treated as a fiscal investment since day 1 of ENIC's takeover and management. The seemingly saw programs like Southampton, Dortmund, and other feeder clubs as a more profitable method than invest in prime players that can win now. So here we are with a well known manager, world class stadium, revenue probably higher than its ever been, with a terribly burnt out team -- the opposite of what we had the past 2-3 years.

Why am I pessimistic yet long term optimistic? I suppose that has something to do with the other teams I support (I am a massive Jets and Knicks fan), but more so having to do with the fact that our owners haven't deviated from their path. History has shown that the costs associated with stadiums and arenas can be too cost intensive for a club, and have led clubs to financial collapse. Levy may be a pain in the ass when it comes to increasing the 'pedigree' of the clubs results, but he is hardly that when it comes to the value. He won't invest or provide the club with the finances required to compete with oil or oligarch or chinese money, making this an odd predicament -- yet he also will not risk decreasing the clubs value. Most of this clubs ability to purchase over the past few years was solely on the back of Gareth Bale and our academy. Ryan Mason, Chiriches, Fazio, Townsend, Bentaleb, etc. had been the reason we had been able to spend -- outs before ins with a few exceptions to the rule. With Eriksen being the only TRUE screw up by Levy for getting the ROI required, I do anticipate we will be able to replenish the squad. It is only the club's benefit to increase the results on the pitch, therefore, I do believe we need a refresher. Mourinho is a winner and has a style, and quite frankly, showed his tactics can work and the Liverpool match show that. Everyone presses now, and he has the formula to shut that down.

I don't think we peaked too early. I think we cocked up the '18 transfer window monumentally, as well as being mediocre in other transfer windows...and letting Eriksen's contract run down.
 

Gassin's finest

C'est diabolique
May 12, 2010
37,355
87,831
Think we've bollocksed it tbh. Should have won the EL and PL in 2016. Could arguably have won a PL in 2017 and should have won the FA cup in 2018. Should have won the CL last season.

Nearly all the key players have either left/want to leave/declined and the revolutionary manager has gone.

We weren't brave enough in the market and we're never going to be. José will struggle with what we've got, have a sulk when he's not given the means to sign who he wants, and leave in a funk. At that point we'll have been left long behind the top 6.

Happy new year everyone!
Woah, we're halfway there...

Wo-oah...

1583917567106.png
 

yido_number1

He'll always be magic
Jun 8, 2004
8,646
16,809
Well stop going then if grates so much its getting on my tits complaining about prices the answer is in your own hand .
I believe that when it suits Levy he will invest but he will not be pushed into doing so by fans .
I also believe that Jose is no mug and knows that investment is needed and he would not be here now without some kind of promise of future investment . It may be when the sponsorship of Stadium /Training ground /Shirt sleeves / is all sorted .
It may be tied into the future of the hotel and houses to be built by the ground or the other site whereabouts escapes
my memory who knows but why would Levy not invest thereby devaluing the club that everybody is so sure he is trying to sell it does not make sense you can call Levy a lot of things but he is not stupid when it comes to profit .
What seems clear about Spurs under ENIC is we are always waiting to get to the end of the rainbow and find that pot of gold. We've heard so many different timings of when we should expect to see the club invest. I can remember when we finish in the top 4 as the first. We did that with Harry and we were then told we had to wait until we won the qualifier game against the swiss team. Then when we qualified nothing happened.

We were then told it would be when we are in the new stadium and now it seems to be when we sponsor the stadium, when we get a shirt sleeve sponsor or when we build hotels.

Can honestly say I have zero expectations for the team now, i don't expect us to win any games and obviously we can't qualify for the champions league or win a cup this year. Without the champions league there will be no big summer rebuild and that will destroy us.
 

shelfmonkey

Weird is different, different is interesting.
Mar 21, 2007
6,690
8,040
Well stop going then if grates so much its getting on my tits complaining about prices the answer is in your own hand .
I believe that when it suits Levy he will invest but he will not be pushed into doing so by fans .
I also believe that Jose is no mug and knows that investment is needed and he would not be here now without some kind of promise of future investment . It may be when the sponsorship of Stadium /Training ground /Shirt sleeves / is all sorted .
It may be tied into the future of the hotel and houses to be built by the ground or the other site whereabouts escapes my memory who knows but why would Levy not invest thereby devaluing the club that everybody is so sure he is trying to sell it does not make sense you can call Levy a lot of things but he is not stupid when it comes to profit .

Fucking hell!! I'll be dead by then!!
 

shelfmonkey

Weird is different, different is interesting.
Mar 21, 2007
6,690
8,040
What seems clear about Spurs under ENIC is we are always waiting to get to the end of the rainbow and find that pot of gold. We've heard so many different timings of when we should expect to see the club invest. I can remember when we finish in the top 4 as the first. We did that with Harry and we were then told we had to wait until we won the qualifier game against the swiss team. Then when we qualified nothing happened.

We were then told it would be when we are in the new stadium and now it seems to be when we sponsor the stadium, when we get a shirt sleeve sponsor or when we build hotels.

Can honestly say I have zero expectations for the team now, i don't expect us to win any games and obviously we can't qualify for the champions league or win a cup this year. Without the champions league there will be no big summer rebuild and that will destroy us.

Absolutely, but next season the stadium will be full and the cash will continue to roll in!! Happy days.............for Levy and Lewis!
 

Gspurs11

Well-Known Member
Aug 19, 2012
1,949
8,674
Can't see anyone buying the naming rights for the stadium for what Levy was expecting.

We’ve also missed both of our optimum windows to sell: the immediate buzz just after the stadium opened and the summer after the CL final.

We have a lot of events going on but the main event isn’t quite what it was nearly a year ago.
 
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