Champions League 2019/2020

[spursfan77]

That’s never handball for the penalty. No way.

 

[midoshairband]

Who says we haven't, though? Only time we see the buggers is in the International Champions Cup thing, we get crocks and can't-be-arsed in the regular season

perhaps we have. in which case we have a manager who refuses to play them.

 

[Shadydan]

I don't - because there's about 6 league appearances in the season across that lot.

You can't claim they would have done any worse in the second half of the season we needed extra legs.


A lot of people were claiming the likes of Abraham weren't good enough for Chelsea.

Janssen and Nkoudou got mins in games, Nkoudou was crap against Palace in the cup I remember him missing from 3 yards or something and the Fulham game he came on and produces that cross which is literally the only good contribution he done when he was given a chance. Janssen came on against West Ham and missed a sitter ( I remember, I was there) He's now playing for some dodgy Mexican team.

Skipp got minutes and he's the only one worthy of stepping up compared to the rest of those players. Sterling, Marsh, Amos - just aren't good enough. Look our academy isn't anywhere near Chelsea's that's just the honest truth, we just need to accept that. Chelsea's youth won something like 7 out of 8 FA Cup's they've always had a notoriously good youth academy and rarely used their young players which is why they were so relaxed about this ban.

 

[sausage]

Janssen and Nkoudou got mins in games, Nkoudou was crap against Palace in the cup I remember him missing from 3 yards or something and the Fulham game he came on and produces that cross which is literally the only good contribution he done when he was given a chance. Janssen came on against West Ham and missed a sitter ( I remember, I was there) He's now playing for some dodgy Mexican team.

Skipp got minutes and he's the only one worthy of stepping up compared to the rest of those players. Sterling, Marsh, Amos - just aren't good enough. Look our academy isn't anywhere near Chelsea's that's just the honest truth, we just need to accept that. Chelsea's youth won something like 7 out of 8 FA Cup's they've always had a notoriously good youth academy and rarely used their young players which is why they were so relaxed about this ban.

Kane was so-say not good enough and was Championship level until he was given a chance though.

If Edwards turns out good, we'll always be able to reference those 15 mins total he was given to prove himself that he didn't take...

 

[Shadydan]

Kane was so-say not good enough and was Championship level until he was given a chance though.

If Edwards turns out good, we'll always be able to reference those 15 mins total he was given to prove himself that he didn't take...

lol Kane was an anomaly though, it's rare we get a player come through an academy like that and go onto be world class, all the tools just fell into place with him

Edwards either he had numerous chances at Spurs, sent him on loan and was still acting up, he had talent but had the wrong attitude, good luck to him.

I don't see the point of all this, all you're doing is naming names of academy players, do you actually watch them?, have you been following their careers? How comes you're so sure that they would have done something if they were given the chance?

I agree that Poch's handling of young players can be questionable but to suggest that they should have been given the chance last season like they're gonna make a difference is laughable.

This is just another dig at Poch because poking holes at our manager is in fashion, it's so boring honestly.

 

[sausage]

lol Kane was an anomaly though, it's rare we get a player come through an academy like that and go onto be world class, all the tools just fell into place with him

Edwards either he had numerous chances at Spurs, sent him on loan and was still acting up, he had talent but had the wrong attitude, good luck to him.

I don't see the point of all this, all you're doing is naming names of academy players, do you actually watch them?, have you been following their careers? How comes you're so sure that they would have done something if they were given the chance?

I agree that Poch's handling of young players can be questionable but to suggest that they should have been given the chance last season like they're gonna make a difference is laughable.

This is just another dig at Poch because poking holes at our manager is in fashion, it's so boring honestly.

It's a statement of fact.

Chelsea are using their academy, we very seldom do (for a team that was reputed as 'giving youth a chance').

If you choose to take that as a "dig at Poch", then it speaks for itself. It is fundamentally flawed to suggest that we don't have the players - we have capped internationals at youth level who don't even get the chance to prove themselves. We also have capped internationals who are consistently dogshit (and don't act like they want to be on the pitch) but get picked over the former repeatedly.

 

[Shadydan]

It's a statement of fact.

Chelsea are using their academy, we very seldom do (for a team that was reputed as 'giving youth a chance').

If you choose to take that as a "dig at Poch", then it speaks for itself. It is fundamentally flawed to suggest that we don't have the players - we have capped internationals at youth level who don't even get the chance to prove themselves. We also have capped internationals who are consistently dogshit (and don't act like they want to be on the pitch) but get picked over the former repeatedly.

What evidence do you have to suggest that these players are remotely good enough? what games have you seen to suggest that they have the ability to step up? At least give me some reserve games to reference at least because all you're doing is naming names yet you're not willing to tell me why they should have been given a chance?

What players have been capped at international level and who for? We're they friendlies? Competitive matches, what? And since when did international football solely serve as a barometer to immediately render players suddenly good enough to step up?

KWP is considered amongst one the best players to come through the academy recently, what does that tell you? Compare him to Reece James and they're levels apart. That will answer your question as to why we don't use our academy.

Your post is so unbelievably vague by the way, I don't think you sound very convinced of your own argument. ?

 

[Rocksuperstar]

Just as a thought, has anyone looked at the contracts that Chelsea offer their youth when they "graduate" compared to the wages we offer ours? I would suggest considering other clubs coming in and not only offering first team football but also a larger wage.

Poch strikes me as the kind of manager that, unless you're a key member of the squad, he's got perspective - you go to him and say you want to leave, I expect he'll probably shake your hand and wish you well with your life. It's not a long career so if someone comes to you and offers you more money for immediate first team football, compared to a smaller package with promises of possible bench warming in the domestic cups for two more years.... tough call really.

 

[CantSmileWithoutYou]

You cannot compare our Youth to Chelsea. Apart from last year, they won 5 FA Youth cups back to back and have won 7 of the last 10.

And all with consistently having, in addition to their winning teams 40 plus players per season out on loan.

Chalk and cheese

 

[ClintEastwould]

We haven’t been called a young team for quite some time now. I don’t believe that young players are necessarily part of Poch’s philosophy. Its probably more circumstantial with regards to our players when he took over. We haven’t really had any promising prospects coming through for a few years now and even when we did bed them in we had less pressure for results and most of those who came through eventually found their place in mid table or lower status clubs.

Chelsea is a different prospect entirely as they have been hoarding young talent for years, mostly letting them rot away on loan but they somewhat lucked out with their transfer ban coinciding with Lampard taking over.

 

[Trotter]

Officiating in this sport is a cancer. It’s horrendous at every single level.

It’s one of the most basic rules in football that no advantage can be played in football if the referee has to give out a red card.

Actually laws specifically state that advantage should not be applied for sending off offences (specifically violent conduct, serious foul play or second cautionable offence) unless there is a clear opportunity to score a goal, and then you administer the sending off when the ball goes out of play, or stop the game if the player you would dismiss gets directly involved in the play before it goes out of play.
So referee was totally within his right to carry on.

Just think about what you were saying for a moment, basically you were saying in last minute of a game a player has open goal and that wouldn’t be allowed to stand if a player 50 yards away decided to at that moment punch an opponent to deliberately be sent off in order to stop the goal being allowed because the referee couldn’t play advantage.

I could say that knowledge and understanding of the laws of the game by supporters of this sport is a cancer, it is horrendous at every single level, but that would be churlish, so I won’t.

 

[SargeantMeatCurtains]

Actually laws specifically state that advantage should not be applied for sending off offences (specifically violent conduct, serious foul play or second cautionable offence) unless there is a clear opportunity to score a goal, and then you administer the sending off when the ball goes out of play, or stop the game if the player you would dismiss gets directly involved in the play before it goes out of play.
So referee was totally within his right to carry on.

Just think about what you were saying for a moment, basically you were saying in last minute of a game a player has open goal and that wouldn’t be allowed to stand if a player 50 yards away decided to at that moment punch an opponent to deliberately be sent off in order to stop the goal being allowed because the referee couldn’t play advantage.

I could say that knowledge and understanding of the laws of the game by supporters of this sport is a cancer, it is horrendous at every single level, but that would be churlish, so I won’t.

Haha. Take the pretentious, condescending shite elsewhere. Nobody believes you and/or cares when you say you were a football league referee and premier league linesman. That’s hardly a glowing endorsement of yourself either, owing to the fact that I could say 99.9% of officials in England are fucking morons, but that would be churlish, so I won’t.

For the record, you’re wrong, CHO didn’t have an ‘open goal’ he was 25 yards out, down the left side of the pitch on his own with 4 Ajax defenders back. The fact he decided his best option was to shoot from that far out suggests it was no ‘open goal’.

 

[spursfan77]

You cannot compare our Youth to Chelsea. Apart from last year, they won 5 FA Youth cups back to back and have won 7 of the last 10.

And all with consistently having, in addition to their winning teams 40 plus players per season out on loan.

Chalk and cheese

Plus they pay their young players an absolute fortune compared to us and everyone else. Loftus cheek was on £40k a week before he’d even kicked a ball for the first team. That’s balmy.

 

[Rocksuperstar]

then you administer the sending off when the ball goes out of play, or stop the game if the player you would dismiss gets directly involved in the play before it goes out of play.
...

Just think about what you were saying for a moment, basically you were saying in last minute of a game a player has open goal and that wouldn’t be allowed to stand if a player 50 yards away decided to at that moment punch an opponent to deliberately be sent off in order to stop the goal being allowed because the referee couldn’t play advantage.

So what you're saying is that player can then run around chinning as many as he likes, as long as he doesn't interfere with play?

Well that's an interesting development... I used to joke about starting a game with a hatchet-man who, the second the whistle goes, runs up to the best player on the oppo team and drops him in the side of the knee, then whales on him for a few seconds until he's pulled away meaning, yes, he'll get sent off and you'll have ten men, but their best player is out of the game. If he times it right, with your rule, he could probably get a half dozen good digs in before the ball's put out of play.

I'm for this new rule! Man, i'd love to have seen a match officiated by you, it would be brutal as fuck

 

[dudu]

Actually laws specifically state that advantage should not be applied for sending off offences (specifically violent conduct, serious foul play or second cautionable offence) unless there is a clear opportunity to score a goal, and then you administer the sending off when the ball goes out of play, or stop the game if the player you would dismiss gets directly involved in the play before it goes out of play.
So referee was totally within his right to carry on.

Just think about what you were saying for a moment, basically you were saying in last minute of a game a player has open goal and that wouldn’t be allowed to stand if a player 50 yards away decided to at that moment punch an opponent to deliberately be sent off in order to stop the goal being allowed because the referee couldn’t play advantage.

I could say that knowledge and understanding of the laws of the game by supporters of this sport is a cancer, it is horrendous at every single level, but that would be churlish, so I won’t.

Anyone who says "I could say X but I won't" knows exactly what they are doing by saying X.

Absolute childish comment of the highest order.

 

[Trotter]

Anyone who says "I could say X but I won't" knows exactly what they are doing by saying X.

Absolute childish comment of the highest order.

That was deliberate.
I called out his totally 100% incorrect in law fact, that he stated, for what it was, rubbish he made up in his head.
And twisted his sentence which I quoted to something more appropriate in the circumstance.

 

[Trotter]

So what you're saying is that player can then run around chinning as many as he likes, as long as he doesn't interfere with play?

Well that's an interesting development... I used to joke about starting a game with a hatchet-man who, the second the whistle goes, runs up to the best player on the oppo team and drops him in the side of the knee, then whales on him for a few seconds until he's pulled away meaning, yes, he'll get sent off and you'll have ten men, but their best player is out of the game. If he times it right, with your rule, he could probably get a half dozen good digs in before the ball's put out of play.

I'm for this new rule! Man, i'd love to have seen a match officiated by you, it would be brutal as fuck

No that’s not what I am saying at all, just that in laws of the game it says that you do not have to stop the game to dismiss immediately if it would deny clear goal scoring opportunity.
In case of mental psycho of course you would stop game.

 

[dudu]

That was deliberate.
I called out his totally 100% incorrect in law fact, that he stated, for what it was, rubbish he made up in his head.
And twisted his sentence which I quoted to something more appropriate in the circumstance.

I know you did it deliberately.

The biggest problem with the lack of knowledge that supporters have is down to the absolute lack of transparency offered by those officiating the games. The fans are kept in the dark over so much to do with the rules and laws and decisions that are made by people 'interpreting' the law that it's not really fair to blame fans for their confusion.

 

[Trotter]

I know you did it deliberately.

The biggest problem with the lack of knowledge that supporters have is down to the absolute lack of transparency offered by those officiating the games. The fans are kept in the dark over so much to do with the rules and laws and decisions that are made by people 'interpreting' the law that it's not really fair to blame fans for their confusion.

Firstly, they are easy to find online, so not knowing them is not really an excuse to me.
Secondly, some of the worst people for knowing the laws are former players and commentators, who pass that information to the general public, and that becomes the new norm, even though it is wrong. Sky once put on a referee in panel to live game, and he called out so many errors that the commentator’s/panellists said they never did it again.
Thirdly, there is an arrogance by supporters that they know the laws better than anyone else
Fourthly, there is the tribalism, where people see what they want to see, and twist and make things up to suit their argument.

 

[dudu]

Firstly, they are easy to find online, so not knowing them is not really an excuse to me.
Secondly, some of the worst people for knowing the laws are former players and commentators, who pass that information to the general public, and that becomes the new norm, even though it is wrong. Sky once put on a referee in panel to live game, and he called out so many errors that the commentator’s/panellists said they never did it again.
Thirdly, there is an arrogance by supporters that they know the laws better than anyone else
Fourthly, there is the tribalism, where people see what they want to see, and twist and make things up to suit their argument.

Please point me to the referee's interpretation section of the laws for each individual referee.

Again, why do people have such bad knowledge, because unlike other sports, refs in football don't have to discuss, explain or comment on their or any interpretation of the law.

Penalties in particular. We see the laws interpreted differently all the time. If it was standardized then there would be no issue but we regularly see things being given in one game and then almost identical things not in others.

If these were explained then maybe we would have a better understanding.