Arkadiusz Milik

emiley heskey · Jul 8, 2020

GetSpurredOn said:
I think we either go down the Llorente route again, having an older player less demanding of minutes but still able to continue, which it appears Dzyuba could be the option, as a free transfer, at a point in his career where he may see a bit part at Sours still as a step up from the Russian League. Oh, and as a Mendes player, he’ll go where Mendes tells him.
Or we go for another ‘Son’ type player. Playing a front 3, if we do stick with system played against Everton, then having two of the wider forwards who could also play central, means they can get minutes in the pitch even when not as a focal No9 type forward, stay sharp, and fill in centrally when needed. We tried it with Moura, but the player needs more physicality.
Milik could be, but equally Schick could be worth a look, both naturally left footed so could play off the right in the same way Son does from the left, but have the size and presence to play centrally. Probably could do some kind of exchange deal for Lamela or Moura.
There are others out there. Guirassy of Amiens, just relegated, so could be a deal to be done, size, pace, skill and decent goal return last year in a struggling team.

Hwang hee chan can equally play as striker or a left or right winger. He is basically korean timo werner. His price tag was also low. Sadly today he went to leipzig

mr ashley · Jul 8, 2020

emiley heskey said:
Hwang hee chan can equally play as striker or a left or right winger. He is basically timo werner. His price tag was also low. Sadly today he went to leipzig

Which was a shock

C0YS · Jul 8, 2020

marc aron said:
Very controversial take here but does anybody think that we are not seen by these potential 2nd strikers as a club big enough for them to be a non starter for? Look at Gabriel Jesus for example, he signed for City knowing Kun Aguero was there and he’d have his spots but wouldn’t be first choice but could justify it in his mind - same with Chelsea players (signing Pulisic, Werner, Ziyech while having Abraham, Willian and others). I could be way off base but that’s a thought ive been having watching City or United or Liverpool and the depth they have at certain positions even though they have sure fire starters there already.

Different. Gabriel Jesus was a teenager when he went to City. He'd only be expecting to really push for a starting place at around his current age. We could do that too, probably not the same level, but get a teenager in (though this would block the path for parrot).

Liverpool clearly could do with more depth, but even United have a striker issue. The fact is players know that they wont push Kane out anytime soon. So either need to be experienced and patient, or young enough to bide their time, or a player who could fill in in another position or we have a promise for a long term plan to break into the first team. But it's far from simple.

Also keep in mind, Jose will want someone capable in the air and holding up play, further limiting our options.

rossdapep · Jul 8, 2020

GetSpurredOn said:
Looks like he didn’t manage to replicate his form from Sampdoria once he went to Roma. Better return at RBL last year on loan though, and the Bundesliga is probably closer to our league than Serie A in terms of physical demand.

We shouldn't really narrow our network to one or two leagues but I think we'd do right in targeting players from Bundesliga, Eredivise (serious talent coming through) and British youngsters.

GetSpurredOn · Jul 8, 2020

rossdapep said:
We shouldn't really narrow our network to one or two leagues but I think we'd do right in targeting players from Bundesliga, Eredivise (serious talent coming through) and British youngsters.

Agree, we should target leagues that minimise the risk of not settling in, or taking too long. I’m half of the opinion taking a step backwards could help get us on the front door again. Taking some talented championship players could, in the current climate, help us refresh a tired looking squad with hungry players and homegrown too. Eze and Watkins replacing Lamela and Moura. Watkins perhaps not quite as physical as Schick or Milik, but has been playing centrally this year and has a decent goal return.

nailsy · Jul 8, 2020

JayB said:
Which is about half of what Chelsea are paying Werner. Llorente was (evidently) the best player we were able to recruit on those wages. There's a reason for that, and it's because out-and-out strikers know they'll be making 10-15 appearances tops. We can't change that unless we sell Kane, which presumably no one wants to do, so we have to work around the problem.

We aren't exactly paupers in the wages department. Haven't we got one of the top ten highest wage bills in world football? Definitely top fifteen. There are plenty of players who wouldn't want to compete with Kane, but there are also good strikers who would come in and play for us on the money that we pay even if we do have Kane. We've just got to identify the right players.

C0YS · Jul 8, 2020

emiley heskey said:
we still need two strikers even if Kane leaves... We used to have 3,4 out and out number 9 at our club ...

We also used to play two strikers. Very few clubs have 3 or 4 out and out number 9s

Chelsea have two, neither of which would get many games for us, they are bringing in Werner who is not a traditional number 9, but a flexible attacking player who normally plays that role.

Man utd have one out and out number 9, Igahlo, and he doesn't play. That is a signing we might have been able to make.

Man city, have two number 9s, one was signed as a teenager with a long term plan, that is something we could look at, but every team in the world is competing for long term talents like Jesus and we already have a hyped young talent.

Liverpool have 0 out and out number 9s, they have Firmino who is really an attacking midfielder playing as a false nine. They have Origi, who isn't some great player, who has more often in his career played from out wide

Arsenal have 3 number 9s, the only team to do so. They play one of their number 9s out wide, and two are able to do so.

Real Madrid have two number 9s, one of which never plays and isn't really good enough

Barcelona have 0 out and out number 9s, they arguably have one who isn't very good. Almost all their attacking players can play anywhere in a front 3.

Juventus have one number 9, he rarely gets a look in.

Bayern have three number 9s, but only one gets regular game time, the other two are under 20 years old.

Dortmund have one number 9, he's very good

Leipzig have three number nines.

The thing is we are in a era where there are very few high quality number 9s. They are still a valuable commodity but many top teams choose to play without one and rather pick a player who would traditionally be considered an attacking midfielder. As fullbacks have become the main way in which teams have width. Inverted wingers have taken a more prominent goal scoring role, as that is where the space is. The number 9 position then becomes more about interlinking play and other things, rather than just goal scoring. Some choose to pick a more natural midfielder to do this who can also rotate and combine with other attacking players. Few top teams rely on long balls into a striker as a way to build up play anymore.

People don't realise the extent of how much off commodity someone like Kane is. There are very few elite out and out centre forwards and it's in part this reason that he will always be a valuable commodity. Football goes in cycles, number 9s will come back in fashion and finally there are talented number 9s being produced. A few years ago all the out and out strikers scoring lots of goals in the top leagues were players in their late 20s, with the exception of Kane. Now you're seeing younger players come back into it. But there are now two moulds of strikers, number 9s who can hold up play and press, normally bigger guys, and converted small attacking midfielders. We are not in the mid-2000s, the game has changed.

We probably do want a number 9, but so do most teams. But the fact is that there are very few players of a particular level, and most of them are able to demand a fair bit of game time. Bellow that level you have journeymen strikers, older experienced strikers and young up and coming strikers.

There is a reason why at 35 Llorente is still in a Champions League club. Similarly, Barcelona buy 30 year olds like Braithwaite who are clearly not good enough to start in a midtable team, yet alone a Champions League one. It's why Jovic goes for 60 million to Real Madrid after a half decent season. Why a player like Morata is still traded amongst top clubs, despite never really convincing anywhere. None of these things would have happened 10 years ago. But the market is so different now, a lack of top quality number 9s mixed with number 9's no longer being a crucial roll for a team, though every team would like one as an option. It is a very different world to the time where 3 number 9s was considered a must for every club.

rossdapep · Jul 8, 2020

C0YS said:
We also used to play two strikers. Very few clubs have 3 or 4 out and out number 9s

Chelsea have two, neither of which would get many games for us, they are bringing in Werner who is not a traditional number 9, but a flexible attacking player who normally plays that role.

Man utd have one out and out number 9, Igahlo, and he doesn't play. That is a signing we might have been able to make.

Man city, have two number 9s, one was signed as a teenager with a long term plan, that is something we could look at, but every team in the world is competing for long term talents like Jesus and we already have a hyped young talent.

Liverpool have 0 out and out number 9s, they have Firmino who is really an attacking midfielder playing as a false nine. They have Origi, who isn't some great player, who has more often in his career played from out wide

Arsenal have 3 number 9s, the only team to do so. They play one of their number 9s out wide, and two are able to do so.

Real Madrid have two number 9s, one of which never plays and isn't really good enough

Barcelona have 0 out and out number 9s, they arguably have one who isn't very good. Almost all their attacking players can play anywhere in a front 3.

Juventus have one number 9, he rarely gets a look in.

Bayern have three number 9s, but only one gets regular game time, the other two are under 20 years old.

Dortmund have one number 9, he's very good

Leipzig have three number nines.

The thing is we are in a era where there are very few high quality number 9s. They are still a valuable commodity but many top teams choose to play without one and rather pick a player who would traditionally be considered an attacking midfielder. As fullbacks have become the main way in which teams have width. Inverted wingers have taken a more prominent goal scoring role, as that is where the space is. The number 9 position then becomes more about interlinking play and other things, rather than just goal scoring. Some choose to pick a more natural midfielder to do this who can also rotate and combine with other attacking players. Few top teams rely on long balls into a striker as a way to build up play anymore.

People don't realise the extent of how much off commodity someone like Kane is. There are very few elite out and out centre forwards and it's in part this reason that he will always be a valuable commodity. Football goes in cycles, number 9s will come back in fashion and finally there are talented number 9s being produced. A few years ago all the out and out strikers scoring lots of goals in the top leagues were players in their late 20s, with the exception of Kane. Now you're seeing younger players come back into it. But their are now too moulds of strikers, number 9s who can hold up play and press, normally bigger guys, and converted small attacking midfielders. We are not in the mid-2000s, the game has changed.

We probably do want a number 9, but so do most teams. But the fact is that there are very few players of a particular level, and most of them are able to demand a fair bit of game time. Bellow that level you have journeymen strikers, older experienced strikers and young up and coming strikers.

There is a reason why at 35 Llorente is still in a Champions League club. Similarly, Barcelona buy 30 year olds like Braithwaite who are clearly not good enough to start in a midtable team, yet alone a Champions League one. It's why Jovic goes for 60 million to Real Madrid after a half decent season. Why a player like Morata is still traded amongst top clubs, despite never really convincing anywhere. None of these things would have happened 10 years ago. But the market is so different now, a lack of top quality number 9s mixed with number 9's no longer being a crucial roll for a team, though every team would like one as an option. It is a very different world to the time where 3 number 9s was considered a must for every club.

I agree and I've said for years now that we don't need to target a number 9. What we need is something a bit different.

We now have three rapid runners (son, Bergwijn, Lucas), we now need someone who is a bit clever. Kane will start every game possible, no question and may be able to drop into a 10 but I'd still rather buy a crearive AM/winger hybrid type to play off him.

That way we can go with two rapid attackers either side of Kane or 1 rapid winger, one hybrid either side of Kane. With Lo Celso in the 10. Think we'll have much better balance and intelligence.

Signing another 9 will likely cause the same problems we had with Janssen/Llorente and Kane

JayB · Jul 8, 2020

nailsy said:
We aren't exactly paupers in the wages department. Haven't we got one of the top ten highest wage bills in world football? Definitely top fifteen. There are plenty of players who wouldn't want to compete with Kane, but there are also good strikers who would come in and play for us on the money that we pay even if we do have Kane. We've just got to identify the right players.

We pay the sixth highest wages in the league, but our wage bill (148m) is closer to Everton's (89.5m) in seventh than it is Arsenal's (223m) in fifth, and is less than half of league-leading United's (332m). With the 170k/w wages he's on at Chelsea, I believe Werner would be our third-highest earner behind Kane and Ndombele.

It does seem within the realm of possibility that we could shell out massive wages to entice an established player when you consider that we have major scope for increasing our wage bill which currently stands at a mere 39% wages to turnover, but I just don't see it happening during this period of pandemic-enforced austerity. Don't get me wrong, I'd be perfectly happy to see Levy do it, but it strikes me as unlikely, especially for a player we know will be a backup.

nailsy · Jul 8, 2020

JayB said:
We pay the sixth highest wages in the league, but our wage bill (148m) is closer to Everton's (89.5m) in seventh than it is Arsenal's (223m) in fifth, and is less than half of league-leading United's (332m). With the 170k/w wages he's on at Chelsea, I believe Werner would be our third-highest earner behind Kane and Ndombele.

It does seem within the realm of possibility that we could shell out massive wages to entice an established when you consider that we have major scope for increasing our wage bill which currently stands at a mere 39% wages to turnover, but I just don't see it happening during this period of pandemic-enforced austerity. Don't get me wrong, I'd be perfectly happy to see Levy do it, but it strikes me as unlikely, especially for a player we know will be a backup.

It doesn't really matter where we are in comparison to the clubs above us. We still pay higher wages than 90% of teams so we should be an attractive club for a lot of players. We may not get one of the very best or hottest players, but there are plenty of premier league quality strikers that we could afford.

JayB · Jul 8, 2020

nailsy said:
It doesn't really matter where we are in comparison to the clubs above us. We still pay higher wages than 90% of teams so we should be an attractive club for a lot of players. We may not get one of the very best or hottest players, but there are plenty of premier league quality strikers that we could afford.

In a vacuum we can certainly afford to pay what the Evertons and Wolves of the league are paying, but we're not in a vacuum. The issue is that, as we've seen over and over again and has been confirmed by the quotes earlier in this thread, many players simply don't want to come sit behind Kane. They want to go to a club where they know they can feasibly compete to be first choice, and that simply is not the case at Spurs.

So in order to get them we'd have to pay way over the odds the way that mega-money clubs do as a means of enticing them, and I seriously doubt whether Levy would be willing to do so for a backup. I'm not opposed to it at all, and in fact would love it if we stumped up the money to encourage a player such as Milik to get over his reservations about joining us, but I'd be (pleasantly) surprised if it happened.

nailsy · Jul 9, 2020

JayB said:
In a vacuum we can certainly afford to pay what the Evertons and Wolves of the league are paying, but we're not in a vacuum. The issue is that, as we've seen over and over again and has been confirmed by the quotes earlier in this thread, many players simply don't want to come sit behind Kane. They want to go to a club where they know they can feasibly compete to be first choice, and that simply is not the case at Spurs.

So in order to get them we'd have to pay way over the odds the way that mega-money clubs do as a means of enticing them, and I seriously doubt whether Levy would be willing to do so for a backup. I'm not opposed to it at all, and in fact would love it if we stumped up the money to encourage a player such as Milik to get over his reservations about joining us, but I'd be (pleasantly) surprised if it happened.

But we wouldn't have to pay way over the odds. We pay Ben Davies sixty grand a week. Callum Wilson is Bournemouths top earner at sixty grand a week. You keep talking about Premier League clubs, but there are plenty of good players at smaller clubs throughout Europe and the rest of the world who would get a big wage increase by joining us and fitting within our wage structure.
As for players not wanting to compete with Kane, maybe some players wouldn't be up for it, but there will still be a lot of players who will happily move to a big Premier League club with amazing facilities. We just have to identify the right players which is where we've been lacking up until now.

GetSpurredOn · Jul 9, 2020

nailsy said:
As for players not wanting to compete with Kane, maybe some players wouldn't be up for it, but there will still be a lot of players who will happily move to a big Premier League club with amazing facilities. We just have to identify the right players which is where we've been lacking up until now.

That’s the key bit right there. If players are stressing about whether they’d be guaranteed minutes, they’re not the right players. Addressing the misbalanced makeup of this squad is key, and maybe a step back to signing young hungry players with already a decent proven level of ability but far greater potential yet to achieve, this will serve us better than trying to sign the finished article.

Who’s our next manager? · Jul 9, 2020

Why not get Adebayor back. He loved sitting on the bench and doing as little as possible.

nailsy · Jul 9, 2020

GetSpurredOn said:
That’s the key bit right there. If players are stressing about whether they’d be guaranteed minutes, they’re not the right players. Addressing the misbalanced makeup of this squad is key, and maybe a step back to signing young hungry players with already a decent proven level of ability but far greater potential yet to achieve, this will serve us better than trying to sign the finished article.

Or target good players who are already in a team that rotates strikers.

C0YS · Jul 9, 2020

rossdapep said:
I'd like Schick. Any idea why he fell out of favour at Roma? He was a Monchi buy right?

He's a useful player, but I think 8 goals in 58 games probably explains why. He also isn't better than Dzeko for Roma and has been a mild disappointment considering the hype and the fee they paid for him. So they bought in kalinic, who is a similar kind of player, and had a go with him. It's also worth pointing out that he did well for Leipzig but not well enough to secure a permanent move. Though rumours are they might want to bring him on loan for another season.

Schick would do the job, I'm sure. But, Milik is a different category of player, tough one we are unlikely to sign.

rawhide · Jul 10, 2020

Wages. It’s not about whether we pay more than where players are, it’s whether we pay more than other clubs that want the player.

Yes we pay more than Everton or Bournemouth, but we are competing with clubs like Arsenal and Chelsea who pay more than us to players, so are more appealing.

fishhhandaricecake · Jul 11, 2020

Yiddo100 said:
Wouldn’t say liverpool have great strength in depth tbh

They’ve been very lucky with injuries actually especially their front 3.

dtxspurs · Jul 14, 2020

Bouhafsi saying we're trying to maybe hijack the Osimhen deal. How do we have the money for that?

Screen Shot 2020-07-14 at 12.29.30 PM.png

Screen Shot 2020-07-14 at 12.29.56 PM.png

Gspurs11 · Jul 14, 2020

dtxspurs said:
Bouhafsi saying we're trying to maybe hijack the Osimhen deal. How do we have the money for that?

View attachment 70189
View attachment 70190

This French journo said the same last night. From what I remember, he was fairly reliable during the Ndombele saga

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