Jose Mourinho

spurs mental · Jul 3, 2020

9 draws so far this season. 9. Liverpool have 2. BUT they have also won 14 games by a single goal. Imagine we had turned 4 of those draws into wins. We would be sitting 5th a point off Chelsea and 2 off Leicester.

This is where our mentality needs to improve. I think Jose is the man to help us to do that but the players have to let him.

I think hes in need of an Edgar Davids type signing to show some of our pathetic losers how to have an elite ruthless mentality.

That's why Liverpool are so far ahead. They never stop until the game is won.

Imagine they had drawn half of those games they've won by 1 goal. They'd only be 6 clear of City and it's a totally different run in. Elite mentality wins football matches as much as the quality does. Jordan bloody Henderson has it. Surely to God some of ours could learn to have it.

spursfan77 · Jul 3, 2020

dtxspurs said:
A short sighted managerial appointment by a short sighted chairman.

There is no shot this ends well.

Who would you of appointed and why?

muppetman · Jul 3, 2020

Many sensible points raised in this thread and I think it's pretty much a combination of all of those things:
- Lack of rebuild
- Lack of character of some senior players
- Enic penny pinching when we start making progress
- Interrupted season with Covid (although surely the same for everyone), lack of pre season
- Individual player issues - poor delivery from the full backs, defensive howlers etc

However, as this is the Jose thread we should focus on him.

I want a manager that makes the team greater than it's individual components - something Wilder is definitely doing at Sheffield, Klopp has done at Liverpool and Poch did (for quite some time at least) with us.

I see no signs of this from Jose. People were talking about Klopp's somewhat shakey form in his first season but you could always see what he was trying to achieve. If Jose really is about a solid back line and fast transitions - where is it and is that really enough in modern football?

He deserves more time but I'm not optimistic that this will improve and unless Enic are going to change their MO then we should go back to what made us exciting - which is a "project". Jose isn't a project manager, he's all about pragmatism and grinding out wins - when he can't do that, what's the point?

NEVILLEB · Jul 3, 2020

This is the sort of scenario Redknapp did well in.

He would have plugged the holes in our team with good professionals either on loans or at the ends of their careers.

You can criticise him but for me he was very good at compensating for Levy’s transfer madness.

punkisback · Jul 3, 2020

fishhhandaricecake said:
Sorry buddy but we won’t achieve CL and he’s so limited as a player.
Is he better than any of these players and the answer is no:
City : KDB, Rodri, Foden, D.Silva, Gundoghan
Lpool: Fabhino, Henderson, Ox, Winjydum
Leicester: Tilemans, Ndidi
Man.U: Mctominay, Pogba, B.Fernandes, Fred, Matic
Chelsea: Kante, Kovatic, Jorginho, Barkley, Mount
Wolves: Moutiniho, Neves

he’s physical, he works hard and he can run forwards with the ball, BUT... he’s clumsy, he’s got poor technique, very average at best passing, cant shoot, makes a lot of fouls, positioning is questionable, really mate sorry but he’s a mid table player at best and should be no where near our first XI given where we aspire to be.

Think about this right when we were flying under Harry we had Parker and Modric, he’s not where near what those two guys could do... under poch we had peak wanyama and dembele again hes no where near these guys And if Ndombele sorted himself out then Sissoko would be on our bench all day long.

Agree. It’s disgraceful that he is now one of the first names on the team sheet. A poor footballer and actually lacking a lot of bravery on the field. I’ve noticed this recently he pulls out of quite a few 50-50 challenges. He shouldn’t be anywhere near the starting 11 of a top six team let alone a top 4. We have sunk so low in terms of quality it’s painful.

NEVILLEB · Jul 3, 2020

spursfan77 said:
Who would you of appointed and why?

If you can’t spend big money then you need a Manager/Coach who will improve the players you have. That doesn’t appear to be Mourinho.

'O Zio · Jul 3, 2020

I wasn't a fan of appointing Mourinho in the first place but since we announced him I've always said I'm prepared to give him a chance and so far that hasn't changed for me. The problem is I think Mourinho could do a good job if he gets all the players he wants, but we all know that isn't going to happen. One of the reasons I wasn't in favour of him is that he is just completely incompatible with Levy. If we're not going to back him, then it was pointless hiring him of all people IMO.

Deleted member 27995 · Jul 3, 2020

NEVILLEB said:
If you can’t spend big money then you need a Manager/Coach who will improve the players you have. That doesn’t appear to be Mourinho.

This season, two managers, same set of footballers - bar two - same problems ...

Danny1 · Jul 3, 2020

It's pretty obvious we are a poor side. We are gonna be a poor side for a long time, unless Mourinho is given money (which is unlikely), then we are clearly waiting for our younger players to get ready. The likes of Sessegnon, Skipp, Cirkin, Tanganga & White are all players who have been earmarked by the club for the future & we will be integrating them into the side.

Time to sit back & just enjoy the wins & accept the losses I'm afraid.

brendanb50 · Jul 3, 2020

spurs mental said:
9 draws so far this season. 9. Liverpool have 2. BUT they have also won 14 games by a single goal. Imagine we had turned 4 of those draws into wins. We would be sitting 5th a point off Chelsea and 2 off Leicester.

This is where our mentality needs to improve. I think Jose is the man to help us to do that but the players have to let him.

I think hes in need of an Edgar Davids type signing to show some of our pathetic losers how to have an elite ruthless mentality.

That's why Liverpool are so far ahead. They never stop until the game is won.

Imagine they had drawn half of those games they've won by 1 goal. They'd only be 6 clear of City and it's a totally different run in. Elite mentality wins football matches as much as the quality does. Jordan bloody Henderson has it. Surely to God some of ours could learn to have it.

Mentality is one part but quality is another. Look at the investments Liverpool made and how that brought them on. You turn draws into wins by being solid throughout and waiting for your most able players to come through, we are not solid, far from it.

That quality combined with a manager with an ethos, positivity and the right coaching has paid dividends for them.

We lost that positivity and passion under Poch after a while. Some players needed to go and Poch needed more investment a couple of seasons back to keep building.

Jose was a solid appointment in a lot of ways, the one thing we lacked when at our best under Poch was that winning mentality which in theory Mourinho should have brought in spades. Unfortunately that so far has been lacking, along with any sort of improved tactics and any positivity.

Metalhead · Jul 3, 2020

brendanb50 said:
Mentality is one part but quality is another. Look at the investments Liverpool made and how that brought them on. You turn draws into wins by being solid throughout and waiting for your most able players to come through, we are not solid, far from it.

That quality combined with a manager with an ethos, positivity and the right coaching has paid dividends for them.

We lost that positivity and passion under Poch after a while. Some players needed to go and Poch needed more investment a couple of seasons back to keep building.

Jose was a solid appointment in a lot of ways, the one thing we lacked when at our best under Poch was that winning mentality which in theory Mourinho should have brought in spades. Unfortunately that so far has been lacking, along with any sort of improved tactics and any positivity.

This pretty much sums it up for me.

Metalhead · Jul 3, 2020

muppetman said:
Many sensible points raised in this thread and I think it's pretty much a combination of all of those things:
- Lack of rebuild
- Lack of character of some senior players
- Enic penny pinching when we start making progress
- Interrupted season with Covid (although surely the same for everyone), lack of pre season
- Individual player issues - poor delivery from the full backs, defensive howlers etc

However, as this is the Jose thread we should focus on him.

I want a manager that makes the team greater than it's individual components - something Wilder is definitely doing at Sheffield, Klopp has done at Liverpool and Poch did (for quite some time at least) with us.

I see no signs of this from Jose. People were talking about Klopp's somewhat shakey form in his first season but you could always see what he was trying to achieve. If Jose really is about a solid back line and fast transitions - where is it and is that really enough in modern football?

He deserves more time but I'm not optimistic that this will improve and unless Enic are going to change their MO then we should go back to what made us exciting - which is a "project". Jose isn't a project manager, he's all about pragmatism and grinding out wins - when he can't do that, what's the point?

Trouble is that history shows that under our current ownership, projects will at some point hit the buffers. When do we get a project that reaps the reward of a trophy or two?

muppetman · Jul 3, 2020

Metalhead said:
Trouble is that history shows that under our current ownership, projects will at some point hit the buffers. When do we get a project that reaps the reward of a trophy or two?

I think we were pretty close under Poch, just not quite good enough to get over the line but very fine margins.

spurs mental · Jul 3, 2020

brendanb50 said:
Mentality is one part but quality is another. Look at the investments Liverpool made and how that brought them on. You turn draws into wins by being solid throughout and waiting for your most able players to come through, we are not solid, far from it.

That quality combined with a manager with an ethos, positivity and the right coaching has paid dividends for them.

We lost that positivity and passion under Poch after a while. Some players needed to go and Poch needed more investment a couple of seasons back to keep building.

Jose was a solid appointment in a lot of ways, the one thing we lacked when at our best under Poch was that winning mentality which in theory Mourinho should have brought in spades. Unfortunately that so far has been lacking, along with any sort of improved tactics and any positivity.

I dont disagree that this squad needs some proper investment. Liverpool identified their issues and addressed them. We seem to just shoot from the hip and if an opportunity comes up to get a player we go for it. I strongly believe we dont and haven't had targets identified properly since about 2010.

spurs mental · Jul 3, 2020

muppetman said:
I think we were pretty close under Poch, just not quite good enough to get over the line but very fine margins.

We would have probably gotten over the line if we'd had someone like Milner or even a Rooney in our ranks

rossdapep · Jul 3, 2020

Jose can start the rebuild by dropping Lucas and asking for Aurier to be moved on.

It's clear we bought the pair of them because they were easy options - we knew their cost and PSG wanted to sell. Neither fit into Poch's strategy of high press and defending from the front.

Jose seems to know our biggest issue now (mentality). I'd be happy for Silva to come for a year to help Sanchez and Tanganga. But he needs to insist on having attackers who make better decisions and move the ball quickly, more intelligent runners.

Coutinho on loan would be a good option as he's a lot less wasteful than Lucas, etc.

But Jose will come unstuck if Levy short changes him, which he almost certainly will

brendanb50 · Jul 3, 2020

Metalhead said:
Trouble is that history shows that under our current ownership, projects will at some point hit the buffers. When do we get a project that reaps the reward of a trophy or two?

I think that was the painful thing with Poch - He was that manager IMO, he was that project worth investing in and Levy failed him, failed to capitalise on his impact and failed to push us on as a club as a result.

Never mind though, those managers come along all the time right? We've just got to work through a quick cycle of 4-5 managers - 10 years tops, before we can maybe crawl back and ask him to come back?

Metalhead · Jul 3, 2020

muppetman said:
I think we were pretty close under Poch, just not quite good enough to get over the line but very fine margins.

I think that there was partly a mentality issue and partly obviously a failure to fully back him. Poch wasn't perfect obviously - he had his faults too. I hope that whoever is in charge, be it Jose or whoever comes next is backed over the coming seasons as we all want to see the type of players in the team with the right mentality and quality.

Metalhead · Jul 3, 2020

brendanb50 said:
I think that was the painful thing with Poch - He was that manager IMO, he was that project worth investing in and Levy failed him, failed to capitalise on his impact and failed to push us on as a club as a result.

Never mind though, those managers come along all the time right? We've just got to work through a quick cycle of 4-5 managers - 10 years tops, before we can maybe crawl back and ask him to come back?

Yes, I agree. We will be lucky to find ourselves in that position where everything was going as well as it did under the first two or three seasons under Poch before it all started to unravel.

Real_madyidd · Jul 3, 2020

dtxspurs said:
A short sighted managerial appointment by a short sighted chairman.

There is no shot this ends well.

Either you are an actual optician or an idiot. How can anyone call Levy short sighted? He wants success now, and I can't blame him, after years and years of planning and building we apparently have everything in place.

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