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Poch: In or Out? - You CAN change your vote

Should Poch stay or go?

  • Stay

    Votes: 657 55.3%
  • Go

    Votes: 532 44.7%

  • Total voters
    1,189

Gspurs11

Well-Known Member
Aug 19, 2012
1,949
8,674
After this, there's part of me thinking against West Ham he needs another Kane at Villa moment. One that transforms the group's belief again. But he needs to change; it can't just be the players, who seem out of ideas and out of motivation. I really hope he gets it because I fear the slide will be past the point of the no return if we don't win.
 

Spurs' Pipe Dreams

Well-Known Member
Aug 14, 2011
20,008
32,728
Will an FA cup win gain new fans ? I don’t know how Wigan or Portsmouth did on that front ?

Or might getting to a CL final having been involved in exciting games have been more effective ?

Winning big trophies will win new fans. Not second tier trophies. Playing turgid football.

Sorry but I've given you a couple of disagrees and although o don't necessarily disagree with some points points, I thiy
 

Stamford

Well-Known Member
Sep 15, 2015
4,121
19,830
Mourinho has done literally nothing in his career which would cause his appointment here to make the club we’ve all supported since childhood so morally unpalatable that we’d abandon it.

Those claiming otherwise are just attention seeking, sorry.

Bet they cheered the woodgate winner against Chelsea and he's far more offensive than Mourinho
 

Shadydan

Well-Known Member
Jul 7, 2012
38,247
104,143
Bet they cheered the woodgate winner against Chelsea and he's far more offensive than Mourinho

We've had players involved in racist incidents and wife beaters play for this club and fans have turned a blind eye to it but no, no one wants Mourinho because he upset Luke fatty Shaw

#spursfanslogic
 

coys200

Well-Known Member
May 22, 2017
8,436
17,403
Might sound a bit silly or naive. But I honestly believe the best person to judge the situation is Kane. If I was Levy and I asked Kane and he said to me the guys are fully with poch bar the obvious 2 or 3 and Kane fully believed we could turn it round I’d probably stick with him. Of course the opposite is also true. It’s very rare for a Chairman to have someone like Kane in the dressing room that you could completely trust to give an informed honest opinion for the good of the club.
 

whitesocks

The past means nothing. This is a message for life
Jan 16, 2014
4,652
5,738
Fair enough. I think that once upon a time the fa cup was a bigger deal.

But if people would love to win the fa cup and are willing to hold their noses then Mourinho makes sense !
Also the UEFA cup was not the europa league - it was a knockout competition with the top clubs in europe, minus the previous season's champions. It was tough and certainly a top tier trophy.

But that was some time ago.
 

LeParisien

Wrong about everything
Mar 5, 2018
3,212
8,169
We've had players involved in racist incidents and wife beaters play for this club and fans have turned a blind eye to it but no, no one wants Mourinho because he upset Luke fatty Shaw

#spursfanslogic
Shady the strawman was a jolly happy soul...
 

dudu

Well-Known Member
Jan 28, 2011
5,314
11,048
What’s your point?

That managers who win trophies don't "always" win over fans. Mourinho didn't even win over United fans despite the trophies, though I guess they are spoilt and have won enough to be picky.

If you think Mourinho or anyone can come here, win a Carabo cup followed by months of shit football and unrest and people will be 'won over' cos he won a trophy, then I respectfully disagree.

Juande Ramos didn't win over the fans because of his trophy.

It's fine to want Jose.

If he will come here to work under the constraints we have, I would take him as I think we would see a different personality because of it but I'm not just going to be won over because of a trophy.

If we would have won the CL, with exactly the same league form last season and this, would you not still want Poch out?
 

rez9000

Any point?
Feb 8, 2007
11,942
21,098
Vote update:

1,152 votes cast and the margin is now very tight.

54.8% Poch to stay
45.2% Poch to go

That’s a margin of only 9.6%

I’ll look to do some form of graphic showing the changes over time when I get a spare moment.
 

LeParisien

Wrong about everything
Mar 5, 2018
3,212
8,169
Don't know if you're using strawman in the right context there mate ?
“No one wants Mourinho because he upset Luke Fatty Shaw”.

I get that you’re speaking colourfully but that doesn’t begin to cover the objections which are not mainly moral objections.
 

roshambo

@thereoncewasaspur
Jul 4, 2011
18
31
Of course Pochettino should go. I'm not sure I can really understand the argument for keeping him at this point.

The results are horrendous.

The players aren't playing for him on the pitch.

He was out-thought and his players out-fought AT HOME by Sheffield United, Watford, Newcastle and other football luminaries.

He has shown zero, absolutely nothing, in terms of succession planning - if you think about our team in their prime and some of the players that aren't at that level or with us now (so Walker, Toby, Jan, Rose, Wanyama and Dembele) only Dembele has arguably been replaced by Sissoko and at nowehre near the same level. And it's not about spending - I saw £42m Davinson Sanchez absolutely manhandled by David bloody McGoldrick, and a midfield of Lo Celso, Sissoko and Ndombele outplayed by Championship players from last year.

He has to go, and the sooner the better. I don't dislike him (how could you? he's been sensational for us) but the writing has been on the wall for a long time and when I see people talking about the points we are off 5th or how a turnaround is just about to happen, I genuinely wonder what planet they're living on. It's not going to happen.
 

Shadydan

Well-Known Member
Jul 7, 2012
38,247
104,143
“No one wants Mourinho because he upset Luke Fatty Shaw”.

I get that you’re speaking colourfully but that doesn’t begin to cover the objections which are not mainly moral objections.

So apart from the many posts in here which practically point to the fact that he's upset a few players I don't see any other reason why Spurs fans wouldn't want him, oh yeah apart from his Chelsea connections, but then again Glenn Hoddle used to play for and manage them as did Gus Poyet so...
 

freeeki

Arsehole.
Aug 5, 2008
11,836
69,426
That managers who win trophies don't "always" win over fans. Mourinho didn't even win over United fans despite the trophies, though I guess they are spoilt and have won enough to be picky.

If you think Mourinho or anyone can come here, win a Carabo cup followed by months of shit football and unrest and people will be 'won over' cos he won a trophy, then I respectfully disagree.

Juande Ramos didn't win over the fans because of his trophy.

It's fine to want Jose.

If he will come here to work under the constraints we have, I would take him as I think we would see a different personality because of it but I'm not just going to be won over because of a trophy.

If we would have won the CL, with exactly the same league form last season and this, would you not still want Poch out?

I said "win". I did not say "win over". Big difference.

LeParisien was talking about us winning new fans, and my point was that new fans generally gravitate toward a club to support based on either success, locality, or in some cases family ties or being drawn to a particular player.

But success is the big one IMO. It's why Liverpool have such a huge global fan base despite being relatively unsuccessful (by their historical standards) for the past 30 years.

My original point was, the success which generally tends to follow Mourinho around is going to be more attractive to potential new fans than the Pochettino dirge to which we've now become accustomed.
 

dudu

Well-Known Member
Jan 28, 2011
5,314
11,048
I said "win". I did not say "win over". Big difference.

LeParisien was talking about us winning new fans, and my point was that new fans generally gravitate toward a club to support based on either success, locality, or in some cases family ties or being drawn to a particular player.

But success is the big one IMO. It's why Liverpool have such a huge global fan base despite being relatively unsuccessful (by their historical standards) for the past 30 years.

My original point was, the success which generally tends to follow Mourinho around is going to be more attractive to potential new fans than the Pochettino dirge to which we've now become accustomed.

Interesting point. I think we have definitely won a lot of new fans in recent years thanks to players like Kane and Son and I am sure we would have won a few thanks to our CL run last year.

Would we have won more had we won? Probably - would they be regretting it right now?
 

LeParisien

Wrong about everything
Mar 5, 2018
3,212
8,169
So apart from the many posts in here which practically point to the fact that he's upset a few players I don't see any other reason why Spurs fans wouldn't want him, oh yeah apart from his Chelsea connections, but then again Glenn Hoddle used to play for and manage them as did Gus Poyet so...
So you do not understand the objections to Mourinho. I’ll try to be bring them together clearly but there may be others.

- Yes, his man management skills since he left Inter can be called into question. Top pros at Porto, Chelsea and Inter spoke in glowing terms about him - he had an aura, he was the special one. There are still players who love him but the shine has gone when you look at his record since summer 2010. It’s not just Luke fatty Shaw.

- He hasn’t overachieved since Inter. His most significant achievement this decade was winning the league with Chelsea. They deserved it and were good with an electric Hazard. It wasn’t a vintage edition though. City challenged but every other side was poor. We had Tim. Liverpool were in disarray. United and Arsenal were stagnating under vanGaal and Wenger.

Nothing else he has done this decade represents overachievement ie the manager really added significant value. We are still in a position where to compete we need to overachieve ie manager needs to add magic.

- Mourinho hasn’t developed players who are world class potential since his first spell at Chelsea. Young players dont develop under him. We are going to be in the market for the kind of player who Mourinho won’t develop. Unlike all of his clubs since Porto, we will not be buying ready-made world class players.

- He plays turgid football. That is not the Spurs way.

- He has notable instances of falling out with non-playing staff that creates instability at a club eg chairmen and doctors.


There we have 5 fairly substantial critiques of Mourinhos fit for our club. He’d be great at a PSG perhaps. But not at spurs. Even if just a couple of these are valid, we would be prudent to look elsewhere.

And yes some of these things are true now. But you don’t fire someone to hire in the same problems on more money.
 

Everlasting Seconds

Well-Known Member
Jan 9, 2014
14,914
26,616
G: ?he also needs to not alienate players and think that previous decisions work with this current crop because it doesn’t
IMO this is the core of what I believe Pochettino could bring to the table in terms of turning things around.

And anyway, to me JJ's latest read very much like educated opinions.
 
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WiganSpur

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
15,974
32,682
The big thing for me is the players , if they were ALL still behind Him and the results weren’t great I’d be more than happy to give him more time, but it looks like they’re not and that can only go one way
It’s the performances that are the big give away, not the results. I think a lot of fans would see it if we were battering teams and not getting the results.

This actually happened at the start of Pochs second season with us, and it was obvious that results would follow soon.

I’m not getting that vibe at all this season.
 
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