What's new

Jose Mourinho

How do you feel about Mourinho appointment

  • Excited - silverware here we come baby

    Votes: 666 46.7%
  • Meh - will give him a chance and hope he is successful

    Votes: 468 32.8%
  • Horrified - praying for the day he'll fuck off

    Votes: 292 20.5%

  • Total voters
    1,426

BringBack_leGin

Well-Known Member
Jul 28, 2004
27,719
54,929
Got it spot in again today, the team didn’t catch on until half time though. Southampton were seemingly on top but I said to my mate at half time the warning signs were there, disallowed goals, offsides. We just didn’t click until NDombele swivelled for our first. Suddenly we knew what we were meant to be doing.

Exactly . First half and second half we did the exact same things, it’s just that a moment of brilliant from Ndombele unlocked it and in the second half we suddenly had rhythm in what we did due to the new found confidence.

Nobody is questioning his ability. He’s a brilliant footballer. Does not do enough, does not offer enough

Our record signing needs to show more, do more, create more. Run more
Needs to do everything more in a pivotal role in the middle of the park...

Saw just as much ball in the first half as the other two midfielder, did far more with it. 5 fewer touches than Lo Celso had second half.

Not a subjective point, but statistical.
 

kendoddsdadsdogsdead

Well-Known Member
Aug 29, 2011
2,140
3,574
Ndombele was our best midfielder first half. He actually tried to play football, was difficult with what was around him but he tried to get it down. The other two were just poor, no composure at all. I wouldn’t mind as much if they were good defensively but they just chase shadows.
 

spursfan77

Well-Known Member
Aug 13, 2005
46,679
104,956
Ndombele = Passenger

Exactly the same player we saw last season. Four lovely bits of play in 45 mins from our central midfield playmaker

Needs to be sold and replaced in the next 2 weeks

You can’t complain about Ndombele like that on here else you’ll get lots of negative ratings from people who refuse to see the whole picture. After half time there were so many people moaning about him being taken off. But with him on the pitch in the first half we were really struggling. If ever the problem with him was evident it was today. Surely the switch must have been flicked for people if they watched the game. If not, it never will. Yes he did well for the goal but his fitness is miles off. GLC will get picked ahead of him quite rightly for the majority of games. Ndombele’s fitness is his Achilles heel no doubt about it.
 

spursfan77

Well-Known Member
Aug 13, 2005
46,679
104,956
Nope. He’s a player. Managed perfectly today. Fast forward a couple of months and we’ll have the player we need.

Hopefully. Start him in the next game and try and build his match fitness. But we seem to be starting again with him at a very low base.
 

Tucker

Shitehawk
Jul 15, 2013
31,127
146,000
Clearly there was a plan to exploit their high line today and it worked. Our midfield struggled because most of them aren’t fit. People need to temper their expectations going into games right now, this will come good. We have tremendous players in most positions, and a coach who has won it all.
 

wrd

Well-Known Member
Aug 22, 2014
13,603
58,005
Exactly . First half and second half we did the exact same things, it’s just that a moment of brilliant from Ndombele unlocked it and in the second half we suddenly had rhythm in what we did due to the new found confidence.



Saw just as much ball in the first half as the other two midfielder, did far more with it. 5 fewer touches than Lo Celso had second half.

Not a subjective point, but statistical.

If people want to point fingers, we need to point them at our two central midfielders tasked with winning the ball and recycling it to our creative player. In the end he made it happen all by himself.
 

Wadec

Well-Known Member
May 14, 2014
1,761
5,434
People need to see that we are transitioning as a side, we are set up now for quick incisive counters with vertical aggressive passing. First half we were slightly misjudged runs from having 3 goals at half time.

Second half clicked and we looked like scoring every time we pushed forward.

Out of possession needs work, think both new boys are adapting to their roles.

Doherty is used to being a wing back so now has to learn to time his burst forwards more, did a much better job the second half.

PEH is learning his role with slight tweaks, at Southampton the whole team pressed and hurried, here he has to only do it in certain areas as it leaves gaps. Again looked better the second half.

Could we improve at CB? Probably, it looks like Jose is trying to do that.

Game management of Ndombele this season has been spot on, building his fitness well.

I'll say it again, trust in the process.
 

Shadydan

Well-Known Member
Jul 7, 2012
38,247
104,143
That comment shows you up a bit as you don’t understand the criticisms. You can disagree with them but you should understand them first.

We’re 10 months in and the squad is more talented than it has shown under Mourinho. There is precious little evidence of a plan forming beyond relying on moments of inspiration from his very talented forwards.

That is falsifiable so go ahead and explain Mourinhos plan for the side if it is apparent 10 months in.

Similarly if there are reasons for optimism in the past 10 months then please share them. You might turn to fewer goals conceded than under Poch? The improvement is extremely modest. And xG conceded is higher than under Poch over comparable timeframe.

So beyond blind optimism or endless patience, there is not that much to support your view is there?

The good (or bad) thing for you is that I'm not gonna let you get away with that stat which needs a load of context added to it, here 10 months correct, 4 of those months we've been in lockdown and pre season, come on it's not Twitter, you're better than that.

There was concrete evidence of forward planning post lockown, whether you chose not to see it due to our own personal bias is completely up to you, the alarming thing for me and I'm agreeing is that we looked like we're not as solid as we were last season, whether that's due to fitness or confidence or not playing up to instruction I'm not sure but to say there's been little evidence of a plan forming is entirely nonsense. Last week we attempted to press Everton high up the pitch but were pressing in the wrong zones, today we picked Southampton off on the counter due to them having a high line and Jose exploting their weakness dropping Kane deeper after HT.

You clearly have an agenda, the problem with people like you is that you're too quick to jump on the bandwagon because whatever you'll see you'll turn it into a negative in order to strengthen your confirmation bias. Coming into the thread at HT is just foolish, it's your own fault you're embarrassed.
 

kendoddsdadsdogsdead

Well-Known Member
Aug 29, 2011
2,140
3,574
You can’t complain about Ndombele like that on here else you’ll get lots of negative ratings from people who refuse to see the whole picture. After half time there were so many people moaning about him being taken off. But with him on the pitch in the first half we were really struggling. If ever the problem with him was evident it was today. Surely the switch must have been flicked for people if they watched the game. If not, it never will. Yes he did well for the goal but his fitness is miles off. GLC will get picked ahead of him quite rightly for the majority of games. Ndombele’s fitness is his Achilles heel no doubt about it.

i don’t think it should be either or though. if they both play maybe we can look to dominate the ball and take pressure of the defensive side of the game but also have that ability to counter at pace with passes through the lines. Stick them two with a very good athletic defensive midfielder it would be a very good midfield. Honestly it might sound harsh but the other two that started today don’t really offer much either side of the ball.
 

TheCheeseRoom

Well-Known Member
May 14, 2019
314
1,515
Have a lot of time for Jeans as a pundit but he appears to have a vendetta against mourinho. The whole first half he spun a narrative of the players not playing for the manager and not having a plan for moving the ball forwards. Low and behold after the break we’re hitting Southampton’s high line. Didn’t hear a single bit of praise from jenas in the second half aside from that for individuals.
 

Tucker

Shitehawk
Jul 15, 2013
31,127
146,000
Have a lot of time for Jeans as a pundit but he appears to have a vendetta against mourinho. The whole first half he spun a narrative of the players not playing for the manager and not having a plan for moving the ball forwards. Low and behold after the break we’re hitting Southampton’s high line. Didn’t hear a single bit of praise from jenas in the second half aside from that for individuals.

He’s like Neville commentating on United, as soon as we go a goal down he’s bringing the doom and gloom. I get why people are hesitant about Mourinho and might not like him etc. But everyone needs to give him a little bit of trust and see what happens.
 

GutBucket

Well-Known Member
May 26, 2013
6,808
11,491
Mourinho said that he will make mistakes, but not the same mistake twice. Dropping Dele and not subbing Sissoko were good adjustments, also 433 instead of some 424 hybrid formation. Good adjustment for Hojbjerg in second half with some repositioning too. Needs to drop Lucas in favor of Bergwijn though.
 

VegasII

Well-Known Member
May 14, 2008
9,750
16,670
Have a lot of time for Jeans as a pundit but he appears to have a vendetta against mourinho. The whole first half he spun a narrative of the players not playing for the manager and not having a plan for moving the ball forwards. Low and behold after the break we’re hitting Southampton’s high line. Didn’t hear a single bit of praise from jenas in the second half aside from that for individuals.

He can be a bit denim.
 

THFC_SWE

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
1,233
3,914
The state from some of you.

Play poorly and badly - Mourinho's fault.
Just won a game 5-2 - no credit to Mourinho.

Always the gaffer fault when things went wrong and always the players awesomeness when things went right.

He's here for barely a year but just incoming players alone, we have upgraded 4 of the starting XI, and Hart, being a personnel of experience and mentality so much needed in the dressing room over Vorm.

Mid-game calls of sacking him will be so ridiculously prevalent this season unless we lead 2 goals in the first half.

But for better or worse, today's show this is a sport of two halves.

Bear in mind the current squad is the most balanced we have in a long long time. And we may still be adding a few more quality players in the coming weeks.

The prejudice against Mourinho is getting ridiculous ffs .

I defended him last season, but the performances this season (apart from 2nd half today) has been shambolic. Yes, he should get praise for the 2nd half. At the same time he should get criticized for the way we have played. With the players we have, we should look much better when attacking. Instead we play long ball after long ball, looking completely clueless on how to attack.

If we continue to play like we did in the 2nd half, I'm the first one to admit I was wrong. Until then I'm sceptic.
 

The boy hoddle

Active Member
Jan 21, 2016
63
148
Completely get where you’re coming from and it’s not pretty and it could go tits up but dont forget Jose’s squad at man.u was pretty poor whereas the one we are building for him is starting to be quite immense. Weve won fuck all for so long let’s try and give this man a bit of time, today has shown how he’s trying to get us to play, it’s slowly starting take shape, the issue is we aren’t as solid as we need to be to play this way but add in a top CB, CM and bale and regulion and You’ll see how effective this style can be. Also it’s boring not winning anything and if this style gets us results I’m ok with it for a few seasons.

it took klopp 3 seasons to finish above us and he gradually changed basically the whole squad, i do think we really need to stay patient.
let’s get the signings in Jose needs first and then judge, even already we can see how PEH and Doherty have improved us.
Some fair points I guess time will tell
 

idontgetit

Well-Known Member
Aug 21, 2011
14,404
30,801
People are committing the sin of equating correlation with causation, without bothering to explain exactly why the two are the same.

The game changed completely in the second half. N'dombele got dubbed off for Lo Celso who came on and had a great game while Kane and Son tore Southampton to shreds.

Apparently Mourinho deserves credit for swapping off N'dombele for Lo Celso so if you're going to state that (and especially if you're going to slag everyone off for questioning it at the time) then you should explain why exactly N'dombele deserved to come off rather Winks.

What we needed was for creative players to regularly get the ball in space and start hitting good balls behind the Southampton press, in co-ordination with actual runs being made by the forwards.

The reason that failed to happen in the first half but happened in the second half is because Southampton worked and tackled themselves bloody during the first half. More than that, we failed to hurt them and they started getting a fuck ton of success with their press.

An intense pressing game requires total commitment, if you half arse it is worse than never attempting it. The more success they got the more confident they got the more they pressed, the more they pressed the more success they got and the more they pressed. It's a feedback loop and the failure of our midfield to break that press and assert themselves on the game just fed into that loop.

The main thing that changed the game was not N'dombele coming off. He was one of the few players that actually broke their press and opened up space a couple of times. He did it for Son's equaliser. Winks however spent the entire first half much the same as he did the entire Everton game, just going through the motions. Tippy, tappy back and forward. He never asserted himself on that game or did anything to damage Southamptons confidence in pressing him or the rest of the side. Twice in fact he actually fucked us up when breaking their press.

You know what other things correlated with the game turning around? The length of time that the game went on. You know what else correlated with the game changing? Kane and Son, out of nowhere, tearing their high line a new arsehole a couple of times. When a team works itself to the bone tackling and pressing, they get tired. Southampton got tired and it opened us space because they didn't stop pressing. Kane and Son took advantage of that and it broke their confidence in pressing. They still kept pressing but now as a unit they weren't committed. It turned their high press into a total liability.

Lo Celso coming on took full on advantage of this and deserves all the credit he's got. Mourinho though probably doesn't and needs to sort out the team system to start minute one of the next match, rather than trying to fix it at half time and blaming his players.

It sounds like I'm shitting on Winks here but in the system that Mourinho has tried to play, he is required to step up and run the game. If he doesn't do that then he's a passenger.
 
Last edited:

chelmyid

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2010
435
1,568
The state from some of you.

Play poorly and badly - Mourinho's fault.
Just won a game 5-2 - no credit to Mourinho.

Always the gaffer fault when things went wrong and always the players awesomeness when things went right.

He's here for barely a year but just incoming players alone, we have upgraded 4 of the starting XI, and Hart, being a personnel of experience and mentality so much needed in the dressing room over Vorm.

Mid-game calls of sacking him will be so ridiculously prevalent this season unless we lead 2 goals in the first half.

But for better or worse, today's show this is a sport of two halves.

Bear in mind the current squad is the most balanced we have in a long long time. And we may still be adding a few more quality players in the coming weeks.

The prejudice against Mourinho is getting ridiculous ffs .
I would ignore the posters you refer to as much as the media - agenda driven bollocks
 

chelmyid

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2010
435
1,568
People are committing the sin of equating correlation with causation, without bothering to explain exactly why the two are the same.

The game changed completely in the second half. N'dombele got dubbed off for Lo Celso who came on and had a great game while Kane and Son tore Southampton to shreds.

Apparently Mourinho deserves credit for swapping off N'dombele for Lo Celso so if you're going to state that (and especially if you're going to slag everyone off for questioning it at the time) then you should explain why exactly N'dombele deserved to come off rather Winks.

What we needed was for creative players to regularly get the ball in space and start hitting good balls behind the Southampton press, in co-ordination with actual runs being made by the forwards.

The reason that failed to happen in the first half but happened in the second half is because Southampton worked and tackled themselves bloody during the first half. More than that, we failed to hurt them and they started getting a fuck ton of success with their press.

An intense pressing game requires total commitment, if you half arse it is worse than never attempting it. The more success they got the more confident they got the more they pressed, the more they pressed the more success they got and the more they pressed. It's a feedback loop and the failure of our midfield to break that press and assert themselves on the game just fed into that loop.

The main thing that changed the game was not N'dombele coming off. He was one of the few players that actually broke their press and opened up space a couple of times. He did it for Son's equaliser. Winks however spent the entire first half much the same as he did the entire Everton game, just going through the motions. Tippy, tappy back and forward. He never asserted himself on that game or did anything to damage Southamptons confidence in pressing him or the rest of the side. Twice in fact he actually fucked us up when breaking their press.

You know what other things correlated with the game turning around? The length of time that the game went on. You know what else correlated with the game changing? Kane and Son, out of nowhere, tearing their high line a new arsehole a couple of times. When a team works itself to the bone tackling and pressing, they get tired. Southampton got tired and it opened us space because they didn't stop pressing. Kane and Son took advantage of that and it broke their confidence in pressing. They still kept pressing but now as a unit they weren't committed.

Lo Celso coming on took full on advantage of this and deserves all the credit he's got. Mourinho though probably doesn't and needs to sort out the team system to start minute one of the next match, rather than trying to fix it at half time and blaming his players.

It sounds like I'm shitting on Winks here but in the system that Mourinho has tried to play, he is required to step up and run the game. If he doesn't do that then he's a passenger.
Agreed - Winks is neither here nor there unfortunately. He looks lost in what appears to be an obvious leaning towards a 433 in attack and 4231 when not in possession.
That’s not a shitty dig at winks - but sometimes being ruthless separates the winners from the almost....
 

fishhhandaricecake

Well-Known Member
Nov 15, 2018
18,702
46,941
Just concerns me that Doherty is so attacking and maybe will leave us exposed at right back.

Also saints fans (although admittedly salty) were saying PEH average and he has been a little iffy for us thus far.

I’m just stressing as so concerned we have world class players like Kane, Son and now Bale and hope rest of team don’t let them down.
Calm. :)
 
Top