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World Cup Discussion Thread - Day 4 (17 June)

Gb160

Well done boys. Good process
Jun 20, 2012
23,646
93,314
I think its disgusting that they have decided against the age old tradition of the world cup that the cameraman pans the crowd for the hottest ladies from each country.

I may go all Liverpool and create a petition.
Being a modern, progressive kinda guy I'll sign the crap out of it!
#WEWANTBOOBS
 

spursfan77

Well-Known Member
Aug 13, 2005
46,680
104,957
It seems nobody wants to put a marker on this World Cup.

I'd love for England to put in the first statement performance tomorrow night with a 4/5-0. Russia's result doesn't count as they were seemingly playing the Saudi Arabia u16 girls team.

Got a feeling it will be the opposite tomorrow night and be a tough game.
 

Gassin's finest

C'est diabolique
May 12, 2010
37,355
87,826
Brazil are a striker short of bring the full team. If they had a fat Ronaldo( before he became fat) this team would be great.
Il fenomeno made any team great. People don't realise or don't remember how astonishing he was.

It's why the clamour about Neymar bewilders me, when he's not fit to lace the boots of genuine Brazilian geniuses like R9, Ronaldinho, Romario or Socrates, etc...
 

mpickard2087

Patient Zero
Jun 13, 2008
21,886
32,513
Great program on BBC2 right now

Big Fat Sam feeling sorry for himself is proper nauseating though. Five minutes (literally) into the job he was already meeting dodgy characters for dodgy reasons and still finding ways to make even more money. Too right he had the job taken off him.

Whatever happens at this World Cup, I don't think anyone would disagree that Southgate is a decent man who has spent all his time and effort on the job and preparing the team for the tournament and isn't just out for himself. That will be small mercies at least.
 

steve

Well-Known Member
Oct 21, 2003
3,503
1,767
Big Fat Sam feeling sorry for himself is proper nauseating though. Five minutes (literally) into the job he was already meeting dodgy characters for dodgy reasons and still finding ways to make even more money. Too right he had the job taken off him.

Whatever happens at this World Cup, I don't think anyone would disagree that Southgate is a decent man who has spent all his time and effort on the job and preparing the team for the tournament and isn't just out for himself. That will be small mercies at least.
Definitely was just thinking the same, he's really not egotistical at all, just wants to do a good job, let's hope he succeeds.

Henry Winter said " he doesn't care what the press think " but it's more than that, Southgate is self contained, intelligent emotionally as well as academically, articulate and is so far without scandal. The sort of shit the English press will try and catch him out with doesn't apply and more importantly he hasn't done anything daft tactically or lost games he shouldn't have. Really hope we do well and shut the fuckers up.
 

Bus-Conductor

SC Supporter
Oct 19, 2004
39,837
50,713
55 minutes into the Brazil game, Switzerland deservedly on terms, given as good as they’ve got so far.

Neymar needs to learn when to pass the fucking ball. Brazil’s midfield 3 have been pretty uninspiring.
 

beats1

Well-Known Member
Feb 22, 2010
30,006
29,551
Definitely was just thinking the same, he's really not egotistical at all, just wants to do a good job, let's hope he succeeds.

Henry Winter said " he doesn't care what the press think " but it's more than that, Southgate is self contained, intelligent emotionally as well as academically, articulate and is so far without scandal. The sort of shit the English press will try and catch him out with doesn't apply and more importantly he hasn't done anything daft tactically or lost games he shouldn't have. Really hope we do well and shut the fuckers up.
For england, its debatable

However he has for the U21's, he use to play harry kane RW so he could start Berahino up front, he refused to take Dier to the U21's instead taking Keane, Stones, Moore and Chambers, saying that Dier is young and basically he missed some games as he wanted to settle in to london

Even for england he wants to play Dier(a cb who plays in a back 3) as a DM or not at all, Trippier who isn't as good as Walker as RWB, Walker who is a good RWB as CB(who isn't a CB at all.

He isn't a good manager at all but he is a good manager for PR and being likeable
 

steve

Well-Known Member
Oct 21, 2003
3,503
1,767
For england, its debatable

However he has for the U21's, he use to play harry kane RW so he could start Berahino up front, he refused to take Dier to the U21's instead taking Keane, Stones, Moore and Chambers, saying that Dier is young and basically he missed some games as he wanted to settle in to london

Even for england he wants to play Dier(a cb who plays in a back 3) as a DM or not at all, Trippier who isn't as good as Walker as RWB, Walker who is a good RWB as CB(who isn't a CB at all.

He isn't a good manager at all but he is a good manager for PR and being likeable

You know more about the u21s than me so fair enough.

Regarding England I can see some logic to what you describe. Firstly Dier has played mainly in midfield for Poch - I don't think it's his best position and he'd be playing CB if it was my choice, but I can see why southgate puts him in midfield. Poch does it too and he's a good (but flawed) manager.

I think Trips is a better wing back than Walker, far better in terms of end product and England without a creative midfield need his quality around the box. Playing Walker in a 3 gives England blistering pace at the back and someone who can get forward and join the attack (and get back) which may be vital against bus parkers.

They're not decisions that all would make but their not without thought and a tactical plan, it remains to be seen whether it works of course.
 

beats1

Well-Known Member
Feb 22, 2010
30,006
29,551
You know more about the u21s than me so fair enough.

Regarding England I can see some logic to what you describe. Firstly Dier has played mainly in midfield for Poch - I don't think it's his best position and he'd be playing CB if it was my choice, but I can see why southgate puts him in midfield. Poch does it too and he's a good (but flawed) manager.

I think Trips is a better wing back than Walker, far better in terms of end product and England without a creative midfield need his quality around the box. Playing Walker in a 3 gives England blistering pace at the back and someone who can get forward and join the attack (and get back) which may be vital against bus parkers.

They're not decisions that all would make but their not without thought and a tactical plan, it remains to be seen whether it works of course.
TBF my issue with Dier in midfield is that its far too conservative, Poch doesnt play Dier in midfield when he plays 3 at the back. He plays Dier in midfield in a 4231. Southgate on the other hand doesnt play Dier at CB in a 3 and instead goes for 3 CB's and a DM. There tends to a spare CB in a 3 man defence and they tend to be a DM when in attack hence why Dier would be perfect.

Instead at times it felt like we are playing with 4 defenders with england, so walker in CB makes sense going forward but Dier is relatively fast, better defensively and actually in a 3man defence positionally is decent.

Dier imo shouldn't be dropped for potentially Maguire and Walker at CB when both arent great and experienced in those roles at all.
 

steve

Well-Known Member
Oct 21, 2003
3,503
1,767
TBF my issue with Dier in midfield is that its far too conservative, Poch doesnt play Dier in midfield when he plays 3 at the back. He plays Dier in midfield in a 4231. Southgate on the other hand doesnt play Dier at CB in a 3 and instead goes for 3 CB's and a DM. There tends to a spare CB in a 3 man defence and they tend to be a DM when in attack hence why Dier would be perfect.

Instead at times it felt like we are playing with 4 defenders with england, so walker in CB makes sense going forward but Dier is relatively fast, better defensively and actually in a 3man defence positionally is decent.

Dier imo shouldn't be dropped for potentially Maguire and Walker at CB when both arent great and experienced in those roles at all.

I understand what you're saying and don't disagree, I rate Dier over Maguire, but maybe he's seen something we haven't in terms of the way the 3 play together. Walker at right CB has some merits potentially but also some potential flaws too as you say.

I hope he gets it right, he's trying something that many of us hadn't contemplated and it may be brave or daft (or a bit of both) but he has a plan at least which many previous managers (with stronger squads) didn't appear to.

He's no tactical genius obviously and I take all your points on board, I just think it's a little simplistic to say he's good for PR and likeable only - we'll start to find out a bit more later today of course.
 

spursfan77

Well-Known Member
Aug 13, 2005
46,680
104,957
Big Fat Sam feeling sorry for himself is proper nauseating though. Five minutes (literally) into the job he was already meeting dodgy characters for dodgy reasons and still finding ways to make even more money. Too right he had the job taken off him.

Whatever happens at this World Cup, I don't think anyone would disagree that Southgate is a decent man who has spent all his time and effort on the job and preparing the team for the tournament and isn't just out for himself. That will be small mercies at least.

Fat Sam still can’t seem to fathom what he was doing was wrong. Makes you wonder what other dodgy dealings goes on in football we’ve no idea about. I suspect there’s a lot of people getting rich in ways they shouldn’t.
 

Hakkz

Svensk hetsporre
Jul 6, 2012
8,196
17,270
I understand what you're saying and don't disagree, I rate Dier over Maguire, but maybe he's seen something we haven't in terms of the way the 3 play together. Walker at right CB has some merits potentially but also some potential flaws too as you say.

I hope he gets it right, he's trying something that many of us hadn't contemplated and it may be brave or daft (or a bit of both) but he has a plan at least which many previous managers (with stronger squads) didn't appear to.

He's no tactical genius obviously and I take all your points on board, I just think it's a little simplistic to say he's good for PR and likeable only - we'll start to find out a bit more later today of course.

The obvious move is to target Walker.
 

rossdapep

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2011
21,907
78,644
Il fenomeno made any team great. People don't realise or don't remember how astonishing he was.

It's why the clamour about Neymar bewilders me, when he's not fit to lace the boots of genuine Brazilian geniuses like R9, Ronaldinho, Romario or Socrates, etc...
Neymar believes into this himself seemingly by his continuous show-boating when it's 0-0 and 40 metres away from the opposition's goal.

He doesn't seem to understand that he will never be considered under the same breath until he actually starts to just focus on winning games rather than making himself the centre stage. That will happen naturally once he starts to actually focus on playing for the good of the team.
 
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