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We Aren't Using Modric Wisely

Bus-Conductor

SC Supporter
Oct 19, 2004
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We all know how good Modric is, and that he is essentially our most important footballer. And that when he plays in central midfield he rarely lets us down, and is often the most influential player. But....

I do believe there is a huge but. Along with VDV he is our most intelligent and creative footballer, but since he has been playing in central midfield his creativity - where it would be of most use - has been virtually nullified.

I have been saying this for a long, long time, and giving my opinion as why, anecdotally, and with examples of what happens when we see him further forward, like in the Inter game when he set up VDV. But here is some - the word that dare not speak it's name - stats - to assist this argument.

In season 2008-9, when he played LM with more freedom, in 1902 minutes he had a combined goals/assists tally of 11. He also completed 1276/1622 passes, making a pass every 1.17 minutes.

Since he has been playing in CM, in 1549 minutes, so far this season, he has a combined goal/assist of 2 and has completed 851/1009 passes, making a pass every 1.5 minutes.

So not only is he producing much less goal/assist end product now, but he's actually seeing less of the ball.

The other aspect of Modric in CM is that although he works hard and has proved himself no shirker, defending is not his forte, and I have seen him on several occasions - at least as many as Palacios and Hudd - give the ball away in dangerous areas (Villa eg). This means that whoever plays next to him must be tenacious and dynamic to compensate for Modric's natural instinct to move freely around the pitch. Huddelstone is not dynamic enough and there is very little evidence - except a couple of fortuitous results (and we have all seen results like Arse away prove this to be nothing to do with Hudd/Modric combining) to suggest this could ever work. Jenas and Modric have put in a couple of decent games together (Villa home eg) but these two aren't exactly ideal either as Jenas likes to get forward too, and isn't anywhere near as tenacious as Palacios, or Hudd for that matter. Of the three Palacios is the best match in terms of providing the balance, but for me the solution isn't who partners Modric, but that none of them should. That is, it should be two form those three (jenas/Hudd/palacios) in CM.

What we have in those three are players that all pass the ball very efficiently; This seasons stats = Palacios 86%, Jenas 86%, Hudd 80%. (Modric 84%). So any of those players aren't going to see us sacrifice ball retention (Hudd only marginally).

For me, at the moment Palacios is the most important player to provide balance. He tackles at a rate so superior (33mpt) compered to anyone else (Hudd next best 55mpt) and - this will amaze the dickheads - gives the ball away less than any of our CM's.

They all offer slightly different skill sets that can be tailored to the opposition/injuries/suspensions etc.

If you play this:

----------Palacios----Jenas/Hudd
Modric----------VDV-------------Bale
----------------Striker

Or:

--------Palacios-----Jenas/Hudd
Lennon-------Modric----------Bale
-------------VDV

You are putting an extra brain into the forward line line of midfield, without sacrificing ball retention. Instead of Lennon wasting great situation after great situation you have Modric there to apply a killer final ball.He beats players better than Lennon, and he always gets his head up.

You also add about 300% more ball retention to that forward line of midfield and better RB protection and closing down further up the pitch as Modric does this much better than Lennon.

At the moment we are playing with two, and sometimes three lightweights (Bale, Lennon, Defoe, Pav) in terms of off the ball team contribution, and for that defensive sacrifice we are still creating less than all the four teams above us. It's clearly not a sacrifice that is paying off.

And everyone knows that Jenas and Hudd can feed the flanks very well, and you'll always have at least one those in the team. The double bonus is that instead of being so "open" we will have the capability to open up the opposition, but because we have two more defensively dynamic CM's we won't be quiet so open to the opposition.

We still, in Jenas, have a CM who will support attacks, in Hudd a player with a decent passing range as options and in Palacios one of the best busy ****'s in the EPL.

But we will, most importantly, have our most important brain in the final third, which will mean we will hopefully start to improve an area that I think is letting us down. The ability to play quality passes in the final third. The creation of more genuine top quality chances. Which is why we are by some distance the lowest scorers in the top 5.
 

LukaMotion

WHL 1899-2017
May 17, 2010
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The only 'stat' that i see as important in this case is that Modric has been playing in CM where he has been nothing short of WORLD CLASS this season.
 

Mr Pink

SC Supporter
Aug 25, 2010
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I can honestly say that Modric has been the best player in the Premier League over the last couple of months, if not - very close to it.

Why on earth would you remove him from a position that he has totally excelled in and taken most people's breath away...oh yes its to make sure we can get in both Jenas and Palacios Eek

In all seriousness you make some fair points but I think he's best off controlling our tempo through the centre...he's the heart beat of our side.

I mean the ball he played to Hutton against Villa was sensational and that was from a deep central position.
 

Bus-Conductor

SC Supporter
Oct 19, 2004
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I can honestly say that Modric has been the best player in the Premier League over the last couple of months, if not - very close to it.

Why on earth would you remove him from a position that he has totally excelled in and taken most people's breath away...oh yes its to make sure we can get in both Jenas and Palacios Eek

I thought I'd explained why.

The same reason the Wenger removed the best central midfielder in the league out of central midfield.

And your opinion of Modric's status of best player in the EPl is massively biased. He is, without doubt one of the best players in the EPL, but there are others at other teams, whose fans would be saying the same of.
 

Mr Pink

SC Supporter
Aug 25, 2010
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I thought I'd explained why.

The same reason the Wenger removed the best central midfielder in the league out of central midfield.

oops just edited my post above. You do make some fair points BC, but do you not think he has controlled our play brillantly from the centre...thats where he's likely to get on the ball more anyway....
 

Spurger King

can't smile without glue
Jul 22, 2008
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Seems to me to be a case of square pegs and round holes. I agree that though Modric has been fantastic in the centre, we inevitably miss out on his attacking abilities...and as you say, a more direct involvement in the final third. When he was playing on the left, in what was pretty much a free-roaming role, he really was outstanding.

My main issues with your suggestions though are these:

1) He's never really been too convincing on the right. He doesn't look comfortable there whenever I've seen him play there, and I think we'd be losing more than we'd gain.

2) Playing in VDV's position is a reasonable suggestion if VDV is not on the pitch. Harry himself seemed to think that this was the position Modric needed to play in, when he first took over from Ramos...and I know Modric has said he enjoys playing there. However, if VDV is playing, I can't see him leading the line on his own, and even if he was able to, again we'd be limiting him. VDV is a gifted playmaker that should be playing alongside more natural finishers. If the issue is about us not scoring as many as the other teams in the top 5, playing Modric behind VDV is unlikely to rectify this.

3) Modric is playing brilliantly in the middle, and though he's not necessarily as involved in the final third (though he's still certainly involved a fairly large amount), the benefits of playing him in that position surely outweigh taking risks with the formation by disrupting the entire team. If he was playing poorly in that position then I could understand the musings over alternative systems, but he's playing pretty darn great right now!
 

Mr Pink

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Aug 25, 2010
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I thought I'd explained why.

The same reason the Wenger removed the best central midfielder in the league out of central midfield.

And your opinion of Modric's status of best player in the EPl is massively biased. He is, without doubt one of the best players in the EPL, but there are others at other teams, whose fans would be saying the same of.

Yeah...Nasri, Nani, Berbatov, Tevez, etc....

Of course my opinion is biased but a lot of Modric's good performances have gone under the radar in terms of the media etc...all the plaudits have gone to Bale and VDV.

I serioulsy think Modric has been the outstanding player over the last few months.
 

nightgoat

Well-Known Member
Sep 12, 2005
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So Modric has been in almost inarguably his best run of form since he joined, and I come on here and see this thread... And I'm not surprised it's Bus-Conductor's thread...
 

Mr Pink

SC Supporter
Aug 25, 2010
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Seems to me to be a case of square pegs and round holes. I agree that though Modric has been fantastic in the centre, we inevitably miss out on his attacking abilities...and as you say, a more direct involvement in the final third. When he was playing on the left, in what was pretty much a free-roaming role, he really was outstanding.

My main issues with your suggestions though are these:

1) He's never really been too convincing on the right. He doesn't look comfortable there whenever I've seen him play there, and I think we'd be losing more than we'd gain.

2) Playing in VDV's position is a reasonable suggestion if VDV is not on the pitch. Harry himself seemed to think that this was the position Modric needed to play in, when he first took over from Ramos...and I know Modric has said he enjoys playing there. However, if VDV is playing, I can't see him leading the line on his own, and even if he was able to, again we'd be limiting him. VDV is a gifted playmaker that should be playing alongside more natural finishers. If the issue is about us not scoring as many as the other teams in the top 5, playing Modric behind VDV is unlikely to rectify this.

3) Modric is playing brilliantly in the middle, and though he's not necessarily as involved in the final third (though he's still certainly involved a fairly large amount), the benefits of playing him in that position surely outweigh taking risks with the formation by disrupting the entire team. If he was playing poorly in that position then I could understand the musings over alternative systems, but he's playing pretty darn great right now!

Saved me some typing, thats exactly the way I see it. Good post.
 

andyw362

New Member
Oct 16, 2005
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Forget Bale, forget VDV, Modirc is the best player we have. thats why he plays centre mid. Leave him be and enjoy him. Because in 25 years time we will still be talking about him.
 

Bus-Conductor

SC Supporter
Oct 19, 2004
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Two of the best games I've seen Modric play were in the VDV position against ManU at Wembley, and the other was on the right against Everton at home last season.

Everyone says Modric can't play on the right, should are in mind they were probably saying Modric can't play in the middle before he did (or even after his first couple of games there like Leeds etc).

He is easily clever enough to play anywhere in the attacking three. If he can play left, he can definitely play right.
 

Bus-Conductor

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Oct 19, 2004
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Forget Bale, forget VDV, Modirc is the best player we have. thats why he plays centre mid. Leave him be and enjoy him. Because in 25 years time we will still be talking about him.

But again, I repeat, Fabregas is the best midfielder in the EPL, but he isn't playing in CM any more. Why ? because he is wasted there spending 75% of his time water carrying. That is what Modric is doing now. He will always look good whereever he plays because he is a superb, intelligent, technically gifted, quick footballer.
 

C0YS

Just another member
Jul 9, 2007
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I thought I'd explained why.

The same reason the Wenger removed the best central midfielder in the league out of central midfield.

And your opinion of Modric's status of best player in the EPl is massively biased. He is, without doubt one of the best players in the EPL, but there are others at other teams, whose fans would be saying the same of.

biased he may be, but considering football weekly (guardian pod) have listed him as one of the best players of the PL this season (along with Bale, VDV, Nasri and Kompany) as well as the global media raving about him Pinky can't be far off.

This whole thing is just rubbish. Modric is our Pirlo and my personal player of the season. His ideal partner is Huddlestone, who gives calm to a team which is always trying to attack. Honeslty a month ago you might have had a case, but now? Are you watching the same games I am. Modrics move to the centre, and Bales form where the two most important reasons for us even making the champions league
 

andyw362

New Member
Oct 16, 2005
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But again, I repeat, Fabregas is the best midfielder in the EPL, but he isn't playing in CM any more. Why ? because he is wasted there spending 75% of his time water carrying. That is what Modric is doing now. He will always look good whereever he plays because he is a superb, intelligent, technically gifted, quick footballer.

Modric has a powderpuff shot. He cant play any further forward. Dont underestimate the influence of a water carrier.
 

Bus-Conductor

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Oct 19, 2004
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biased he may be, but considering football weekly (guardian pod) have listed him as one of the best players of the PL this season (along with Bale, VDV, Nasri and Kompany) as well as the global media raving about him Pinky can't be far off.

This whole thing is just rubbish. Modric is our Pirlo and my personal player of the season. His ideal partner is Huddlestone, who gives calm to a team which is always trying to attack. Honeslty a month ago you might have had a case, but now? Are you watching the same games I am. Modrics move to the centre, and Bales form where the two most important reasons for us even making the champions league

Read what I said. He is one of the best players in the EPL, no question. But to say he is the best is biased rubbish. I love the little fella, but Fabregas for example is on a different level.
 

mpickard2087

Patient Zero
Jun 13, 2008
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Dont really agree with this. When VdV first joined IMO Modric was overshadowed as Rafa drops deep and occupied the positions Luka played for us beforehand, this has led to him adapting his game and playing from a slightly deeper position which he has taken to superbly and has really shined for us recently, keeping things ticking (especially without Hudd to share these duties)

When Modric played on the left he was effective drifting in to a position behind the strikers, the area now which VdV operates in, which I fear would mean not getting the best out of him again like when VdV initially joined. Im also not sure that Luka, for all his ability, is really ever going to be a goal threat, his shooting is up there with Crouchy, pretty shocking a lot of the time unfortunately! So putting him further forward may not really be more effective for the team IMO.
 

TwoSaintsComeMarching

PIMP-tastic
Jul 26, 2008
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I agree with you in so much as that Modric needs to be utilised further forward and we need 2 of Jenas/Palacios/Hudd providing the solidity in the middle. But....

... putting him on the right / inside right is not the solution.
 

kaz Hirai

Well-Known Member
Nov 5, 2008
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modric shouldn't take VDV's position because i dont think he would be as much as a goal threat, his shooting technique isnt as good as rafa's, and they are both probably on par when it comes to creating chances

i dont think he should take lennons place, we lose arguably our fastest player slowing our counters right down, and the general threat he poses to the opponents left hand side also an on form lennon should get well over 10 assists a season, not too shabby:hump:

so that leaves him in the middle, where he has been doing a grand job:bowdown:
 

C0YS

Just another member
Jul 9, 2007
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Read what I said. He is one of the best players in the EPL, no question. But to say he is the best is biased rubbish. I love the little fella, but Fabregas for example is on a different level.

Fabregas has been so and so this season, nothing on Nasri for arsenal this season.

But Fabregas plays a diffrent role then Modric (more comparable to vdv) its like comparing snijder and Pirlo you cant they do siffrent roles. And this season Modric has been better the Fabregas acording to the majority of pundits and newspapers.
 

TwoSaintsComeMarching

PIMP-tastic
Jul 26, 2008
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VDV has proven that he can play from the right of a 4231, i.e. like Messi plays from the right. He would be better there than Modric.

Barca line-up like this:

Busquets
Xavi Iniesta
Messi -------------- Pedro
Villa​

We have the players to emulate that system:

Palacios Thudd
Modric
VDV -------------- Bale
Defoe​
 
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