The Y Word

[Rocksuperstar]

I never received this survey, surely I'm the targeted audience for this. Seeing as I'm both a Spurs fan and Jewish.

I'm not Jewish but i am very opinionated so I'm surprised I wasn't included either.

I wonder if they're surveying the Chelsea and West Ham fans on their feelings on hissing and singing songs about Hitler every single time they visit the Lane?

 

[CowInAComa]

Im a Spurs fan, i go to watch the football not because i get to sing songs involving the word yid. So couldnt give two fucks.

If it is a problematic word despite the 'benign' usage by Spurs fans, then lets just stop using it. Easy. Its just a fucking word, dont get your knickers in a twist. It will make fuck all difference to anyone heres life at the end of the day.

Getting all strung up and indignant because times change is so 1970's. Go and watch repeats of Dads Army to calm down.

 

[LeSoupeKitchen]

Im a Spurs fan, i go to watch the football not because i get to sing songs involving the word yid. So couldnt give two fucks.

If it is a problematic word despite the 'benign' usage by Spurs fans, then lets just stop using it. Easy. Its just a fucking word, dont get your knickers in a twist. It will make fuck all difference to anyone heres life at the end of the day.

Getting all strung up and indignant because time change is so 1970's. Go and watch repeats of Dads Army to calm down.

It's more than a word for me. It's part of our identity and I'd be sad to lose it.

My favourite chants contain the word and there is nothing I like more than shouting "yiddo, yiddo, yiddo" at a legend of some description.

 

[CowInAComa]

It's more than a word for me. It's part of our identity and I'd be sad to lose it.

My favourite chants contain the word and there is nothing I like more than shouting "yiddo, yiddo, yiddo" at a legend of some description.

Honestly I dont know if that is a serious post, or satirising people who might say things like there NOTHING they like more than shouting yiddo at a player they like.

 

[LeSoupeKitchen]

Honestly I dont know if that is a serious post, or satirising people who might say things like there NOTHING they like more than shouting yiddo at a player they like.

There is nothing I like more.

 

[daveduvet]

Yids calling themselves 'Yids'
or non yids chanting in sympathy with Yids
and our historical base and history
is anti anti semitic.

I'm from a Jewish background
and I wouldn't chant it
for aesthetic reasons
but I defend the right of Spurs fans so to do.

It's a pre-emptive strike against anti-semitism.
and a call to collective virtual arms.

COYY

Exactly this.
This is because Tottenham fans have performed what is called “value-switching”, whereby “pejorative terms [are] undermined and given a positive valence”. They have in a sense reversed Yid’s meaning. It is conceivable that words develop ameliorated meanings. Yid’s prejudicial meaning has been subverted in the context of Tottenham employing it as battle-cry. This should mean that chanting Yid is not considered to be threatening or abusive when Tottenham supporters chant it. Hence even if someone was to claim that it caused them alarm or distress the first element of the offence will not be proved. Indeed, in a very recent case, the CPS dropped Public Order charges against three Tottenham fans who had chanted Yid at matches because they did not consider it “threatening” or “abusive” when used in this context. This decision is to be welcomed.
For opposing fans, however, use of the word Yid is different. Here context is everything. Its use takes on an abusive and potentially threatening character. It is chanted to disparage Tottenham’s Jewish connections, so is very likely to cause harassment, alarm or distress. (Jenna Morris. International network for hate studies)

 

[hughy]

Did the survey.

Didn't change my mind.

YID ARMY.

 

[Spurs 1961]

Got mine today and did the survey. May have said this before but I feel this issue needs a lead from the Jewish supporters. I don't use the word as I feel uncomfortable. However I do understand some of the reasoning behind using the word and myself did something similar with racist views and language I faced back in the 60's

 

[Duke of Northumberland]

Not this again. Why not ask about the really cringy offensive stuff against Arsenal or Campbell?

 

[yankspurs]

Got mine today and did the survey. May have said this before but I feel this issue needs a lead from the Jewish supporters. I don't use the word as I feel uncomfortable. However I do understand some of the reasoning behind using the word and myself did something similar with racist views and language I faced back in the 60's

Im jewish. I dont give a fuck about the word. I do give a fuck that the club and apparently some supporters believe the word gives opposing fans license to be anti semitic and sing about the holocaust and make hissing noises. It is offensive, ignorant and just being willfully stupid. That survey really ticked me off. Felt like they are blaming us with that predetermined outcome.

 

[Dinghy]

I'm not Jewish but i am very opinionated so I'm surprised I wasn't included either.

You can just go to the questionaire...

https://official.tottenhamhotspur.com/444I-MJ0U-OGEUP-GUSI4-1/c.aspx

 

['O Zio]

Spurs fans singing the word yid isn't in any way the cause of antisemitism therefore banning it achieves absolutely nothing. Chelsea fans will still spout their nonsense regardless so we may as well sing back at them IMO

 

[NayimFTHL]

After reaching the champions league final and completion of new stadium, our brand is growing at a phenomenal rate. We need to protect our brand. Once we stop singing the y word eventually everyone will stop using it. However, some of our fans are either too stubborn or just too dumb to realise this and will continue shouting it. Also it's getting really boring..

 

[LSUY]

If our Yid chants are anti-Semitic then how did we manage to get away with them when we played away against Hapoel Tel Aviv years back? I can't imagine Israeli police sitting idly by while thousands of people sing anti-Semitic songs in the middle of Tel Aviv. Surely Hapoel would have complained to us and UEFA over the actions of our fans? IIRC didn't the Hapoel fans join in?

After reaching the champions league final and completion of new stadium, our brand is growing at a phenomenal rate. We need to protect our brand. Once we stop singing the y word eventually everyone will stop using it. However, some of our fans are either too stubborn or just too dumb to realise this and will continue shouting it. Also it's getting really boring..

So something that grew organically within the fanbase in response to decades of abuse from opposing fans and apathy from our club should make way for the good of the corporate brand?

If Spurs fans stop using the word Yid then the only reason should be because the Jewish community asked us to stop.

 

[NayimFTHL]

If our Yid chants are anti-Semitic then how did we manage to get away with them when we played away against Hapoel Tel Aviv years back? I can't imagine Israeli police sitting idly by while thousands of people sing anti-Semitic songs in the middle of Tel Aviv. Surely Hapoel would have complained to us and UEFA over the actions of our fans? IIRC didn't the Hapoel fans join in?



So something that grew organically within the fanbase in response to decades of abuse from opposing fans and apathy from our club should make way for the good of the corporate brand?

If Spurs fans stop using the word Yid then the only reason should be because the Jewish community asked us to stop.

And they have asked us to stop. So..

 

['O Zio]

And they have asked us to stop. So..

They haven't though. Some Jewish people have said it's offensive, others have said it isn't, others don't give a shit either way.

 

[NayimFTHL]

They haven't though. Some Jewish people have said it's offensive, others have said it isn't, others don't give a shit either way.

Open your eyes

https://www.worldjewishcongress.org...-be-no-tolerance-for-use-of-slur-yid-1-5-2019

 

[mil1lion]

And they have asked us to stop. So..

No they haven't but I think it's the reason for the survey. They may well ask us to stop depending the results but I'm not sure many will. Just as many wont sit down in the South Stand. The club are just going to ask us to do what is being asked from the authorities. I dont think they're actually are the ones driving this. This is the most sensible way of dealing with it. Rather than simply saying not to use the word get feedback from the fans first and discuss fairly.

Open your eyes

https://www.worldjewishcongress.org...-be-no-tolerance-for-use-of-slur-yid-1-5-2019

This isn't our club asking us to stop though. Fuck me this is actually putting Chelsea over as well so forget that shit.

 

[Saoirse]

We have a very good idea of what Jewish Spurs fans think. If I recall from the last survey 6% were offended by it - a lower proportion than that of gentiles offended on their behalf! - with the vast majority actively supporting it and joining in. So I am all too happy to join in at Spurs, or use it on a forum of Spurs fans etc etc. Where it's less clear is in the wider Jewish community, where as far as I know there's never been a survey, the formal bodies don't much like it, but anecdotally we know there's at least a substantial minority who do. So I err on the side of caution and don't use it at all if I'm e.g. travelling to an away game or talking about Spurs on Twitter, where there is room for it to be misinterpreted or to cause shock and offence.

 

['O Zio]

Open your eyes

https://www.worldjewishcongress.org...-be-no-tolerance-for-use-of-slur-yid-1-5-2019

Open my eyes to what? All you've done is post an example of some Jewish people who do find it offensive, but I've already admitted that there are some who do. I could equally just point to some Jewish people on this very site even who say they don't find it offensive and tell you to "Open your eyes". I stand by what I've said, some find it offensive, some don't.

For what it's worth, I can sympathise with those who do find it offensive, I just don't agree with their logic for it. Originally it was a completely normal word for a Jewish person in Yiddish (hence why it's called Yiddish obviously) and that got brought over to English by Yiddish speakers, and it was only later that it got taken over by anti-Semites using it as a slur. In Yiddish it's still a perfectly normal word to use. Personally, I think letting anti-Semites and the like completely take over an otherwise normal word is more of a problem than reclaiming it and being proud of it.