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The Spurs Youth Thread - 2018/19

C0YS

Just another member
Jul 9, 2007
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I'll give you that Berchiche was a late bloomer from nowhere, that sometimes happens.

But the only difference I see is that Naughton got afforded 70 or 80 first team games over a couple of years whilst Smith didn't, because he was seen as the safer option and probably because money had been spent on him. That sort of squad filler signing (iirc the one we really wanted was Walker, and took Naughton as a punt too when dealing with Sheff Utd), for all clubs not just Spurs, is just completely unnecessary and where the vast amount of money in football, in my opinion, goes down the drain.

I watched a fair bit of Smith back then, and I'd rather Naughton any day. Smith had his fans but he was defensively all over the place. He was bypassed so regularly in championship and in the U21s. I think he really wasn't ready for PL football.

On the bolded bit, I'm pretty sure its the other way round. Naughton was having a great season as an under 21 year old and got into the championship team of the year. Walker had made ten appearances of professional football mostly in league 1, he was the punt. With Naughton we thought we were getting a capable player.

Naughton wasn't our greatest player but it was clear he could play in the PL. He got two Championship team of the year awards and was generally ok. I think Smith, despite being the more talented player, would have struggled in the PL at the time.
 

mpickard2087

Patient Zero
Jun 13, 2008
21,886
32,512
I watched a fair bit of Smith back then, and I'd rather Naughton any day. Smith had his fans but he was defensively all over the place. He was bypassed so regularly in championship and in the U21s. I think he really wasn't ready for PL football.

On the bolded bit, I'm pretty sure its the other way round. Naughton was having a great season as an under 21 year old and got into the championship team of the year. Walker had made ten appearances of professional football mostly in league 1, he was the punt. With Naughton we thought we were getting a capable player.

Naughton wasn't our greatest player but it was clear he could play in the PL. He got two Championship team of the year awards and was generally ok. I think Smith, despite being the more talented player, would have struggled in the PL at the time.

Not what I heard at the time re. Walker/Naughton. Naughton was the flavour of the month and had other teams in for him, and it was assumed he was 'the one' and Walker was just along as a bonus in the deal, could be wrong but I definitely remember hearing that KW was the one who Spurs saw having a much bigger future and was the one we were more eager to secure.

We don't know as Smith never got a chance. Both had to do a couple of seasons out on loan whilst on our books, then it came down to one getting sold and one getting a go for 75 games. What he lacked defensively he may have (actually, almost certainly would have....) offered more in attack. And Naughton was never the model of solidity in any case defensively, he was just the epitome of a nothing player really - that might get you some plaudits in the Championship, but it's completely different at PL level. I still think it's a classic example of risk averse, squad filler signing.
 

C0YS

Just another member
Jul 9, 2007
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Not what I heard at the time re. Walker/Naughton. Naughton was the flavour of the month and had other teams in for him, and it was assumed he was 'the one' and Walker was just along as a bonus in the deal, could be wrong but I definitely remember hearing that KW was the one who Spurs saw having a much bigger future and was the one we were more eager to secure.

We don't know as Smith never got a chance. Both had to do a couple of seasons out on loan whilst on our books, then it came down to one getting sold and one getting a go for 75 games. What he lacked defensively he may have (actually, almost certainly would have....) offered more in attack. And Naughton was never the model of solidity in any case defensively, he was just the epitome of a nothing player really - that might get you some plaudits in the Championship, but it's completely different at PL level. I still think it's a classic example of risk averse, squad filler signing.
Ok Naughton seriously impressed on loan, getting into the Championship team of the season, Smith was often in and out of teams he played for. Naughton was solid, but limited, when he played RB, he was pretty terrible when playing LB, which he played far too many games in that position.

I think Walker was very much considered to have a lot of potential, but considering Everton had bid 5 million for him, I suspect Walker was 3 million of that deal. he deal isn't too dissimilar from when we signed Bostock for example, Walker had played incredibly little football before signing for us.

We don't know, but I do know that Smith getting a chance would be nice for Smith, but there is plenty of good reasons why he wasn't. Offensively Smith was, and still is, impressive going forward. But that in itself doesn't mean you're ready to be a PL fullback

When he went to Bournmouth, permanently, he took a season before he saw regular minutes, when he did get regular minutes it was not at right back, but rather as a right, or even left, winger who would impact games from the bench. This isn't a coincidence, I don't think Howe thought he was a reliable fullback. It was only at 24, in his first PL season where he finally broke into the starting 11 at Right Back, and well done to the guy, he has had a good career so far.

However, to say in 2013 or whenever it was, that Smith who at that point had barely even played in the championship should be kept instead of Naughton who just had a decent season at Norwich would have been a brave move. Naughton played two seasons essentially as a starter, mainly because of injuries more than anything else, but his perceived ability at both RB and LB meant he got a lot of games. For Smith to take that role would of been a very brave move. Maybe we could of kept him and brought him back into the fold instead of signing Yedlin, and that maybe is a bigger argument. Though these things are easier in hindsight.
 

C0YS

Just another member
Jul 9, 2007
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Not what I heard at the time re. Walker/Naughton. Naughton was the flavour of the month and had other teams in for him, and it was assumed he was 'the one' and Walker was just along as a bonus in the deal, could be wrong but I definitely remember hearing that KW was the one who Spurs saw having a much bigger future and was the one we were more eager to secure.

We don't know as Smith never got a chance. Both had to do a couple of seasons out on loan whilst on our books, then it came down to one getting sold and one getting a go for 75 games. What he lacked defensively he may have (actually, almost certainly would have....) offered more in attack. And Naughton was never the model of solidity in any case defensively, he was just the epitome of a nothing player really - that might get you some plaudits in the Championship, but it's completely different at PL level. I still think it's a classic example of risk averse, squad filler signing.
tbf when we signed Naughton our RBs were pretty terrible, and he was a prospect, a 20 year old in the Championship really looking above his level. I think when he came to us we realised, he wasn't ready. But he wasn't a boring steady championship player. He would contribute a lot of goals and chances from fullback. For he is just one of those players who on the PL is more exposed and unable to replicate the same levels. This is very common, but I'm certain when we signed him we thought he could benefit us in the future.

Keep in mind, we finished 8th the season before, and 11th ish the season before signing Naughton. We couldn't just pick whoever, and all of our signings that summer where far from fashionable players. But we had to compete with Everton for Naughton. So it was a signing with some ambition, its just that 'half' didn't work out so much.
 

JimmyG2

SC Supporter
Dec 7, 2006
15,014
20,779
One of the great known unknowns about life
is that you don't know
what would have happened
if you had pursued a different policy
taken a different path if you will.
Looking outside the club at established 'stars'
which has been the accepted policy
for many decades in football
or promoting from within
as we have tried to do
with our Academy
and buying in young potential.
.

"The Road Not Taken" is a poem by Robert Frost,
which expresses this dilemma.
You never know what might have happened
had you chosen a different route
to where it would have led.

'Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
And looked down one as far as I could
To where it bent in the undergrowth;
Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim,
Because it was grassy and wanted wear;
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,
And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I kept the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way,
I doubted if I should ever come back'.
 

ohh Teddy Teddy

Well-Known Member
Jan 27, 2011
393
1,428
Rob Burch has moved to Fulham as Goalkeeping Coach, think he was working with our U18's the last couple of seasons ?

Have we announced a replacement for Matt Wells yet ?
 

Spurzinho

Well-Known Member
Jan 24, 2016
2,512
8,342
Rob Burch has moved to Fulham as Goalkeeping Coach, think he was working with our U18's the last couple of seasons ?

Have we announced a replacement for Matt Wells yet ?

Yeh, Rob was one of our academy goalkeeping coaches. As for Matt Well's replacement, no we haven't announced a permanent replacement. I think we're waiting to see how Ryan Mason feels about it first now he's had a couple of months in the job.
 

eddiebailey

Well-Known Member
Oct 12, 2004
7,452
6,672
The likes of Livermore, Caulker, Carroll, poss Townsend who all made a number of appearances in our first team, would not get near it now. The standard is way above what it was. Consequently youth players will have to be approaching international class to get in. It’s just a fact that very few will do it.
Skipp has played a few times but more because of injuries than forcing himself in.
Reference to Adam Smith...6 years back I saw him at Carlisle in the league cup given a chasing by a 4th div winger Matty Robson. If we had held onto him he would never be where he is now. Often it’s best to go and play regularly lower down.
There were times last season when I would have been very happy to have seen Livermore in the starting lineup.
 

coys200

Well-Known Member
May 22, 2017
8,436
17,403
What was Parrott latest injury ? Ireland manager talking about him for Ireland U19 in euros starts mid July. Saying he’s still coming back from injury and not sure if will be with Spurs 1st team or available.
 

Blake Griffin

Well-Known Member
Oct 3, 2011
14,133
38,225
What was Parrott latest injury ? Ireland manager talking about him for Ireland U19 in euros starts mid July. Saying he’s still coming back from injury and not sure if will be with Spurs 1st team or available.

classic kane ankle injury, though this was more due to a terrible tackle rather than the innocuous ones that kane seems to get.
 

spurs9

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
11,840
34,012
Off topic but I know a few people in here rated him very highly a few years back...............Jay Dasilva has left Chelsea and join Bristol City on a permanent deal.
 

Clark28

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2016
2,269
13,040
So with Warburton (and Les Ferdinand) at QPR, I wonder if we'll be trying to loan out others there besides Amos.
 

Locotoro

Prince of Zamunda
Sep 2, 2004
9,326
13,915
I didnt realise Warburton was at QPR. I think at Brentford we under used the potential of sending loans to him. Hopefully, we can get someone like Oyoma over there as well.
 

coys200

Well-Known Member
May 22, 2017
8,436
17,403
Duncan now joined QPR. Feels like something has gone down between the clubs. Maybe some kind of special agreement arranged.
 
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