The Rugby Thread

[teok]

From an england perspective I'm quite glad billy isn't going any more. He was rushed back in the 6 nations before he was fully fit and if he was injured again going into NZ that could have disastrous. At least he gets a decent rest and hopefully comes back to full fitness.

As for haskell, he seems injured himself. Every game I have seen him recently he has offered nothing (if you compare that to the player in the eng vs oz tests who was smashing every thing).

 

[talkshowhost86]

Massive loss for the Lions. Faletau is fine but not the same level as Billy and that's when he's actually on form which he hasn't been this year (partly down to injury).

I think this tour is going to get very messy for the Lions.

 

[E17yid]

Saying Faletau isn't on the same level is fucking ridiculous.

 

[talkshowhost86]

Saying Faletau isn't on the same level is fucking ridiculous.

It really isn't particularly based on the last year or so. Billy's ball carrying and ability to get teams on the front foot is better than most in the world and that's why people are acknowledging what a massive loss it is for the Lions.

In the last year he's been a massive part of a team that has won the European Championship twice and the Premiership and an England team that was unbeaten for a year and won two six nations.

Faletau has been injured and then poor for Bath and fairly non-existent for Wales.

They aren't even comparable in terms of impact at the moment. If Faletau can get back to his best he'll be a useful asset certainly but not as important as Billy.

 

[E17yid]

It really isn't particularly based on the last year or so. Billy's ball carrying and ability to get teams on the front foot is better than most in the world and that's why people are acknowledging what a massive loss it is for the Lions.

In the last year he's been a massive part of a team that has won the European Championship twice and the Premiership and an England team that was unbeaten for a year and won two six nations.

Faletau has been injured and then poor for Bath and fairly non-existent for Wales.

They aren't even comparable in terms of impact at the moment. If Faletau can get back to his best he'll be a useful asset certainly but not as important as Billy.

What, and Vunipola has been injury free for the last few years has he?

Ball carrying is the only area he trumps him on. The stats don't back you up in any area which you and others continue to ignore when I bought them up earlier.

Faletau is quicker, fitter, more dynamic over the ball, quicker feet, retains the ball better, makes more tackles (though this stat is dependent on how your team is playing) has better hands (Vunipola loses the ball a lot more in the tackle as well)

So, yes it is pretty ridiculous to say he's not on the same level. They're both different types of players. It's like Liverpool fans saying Coutinho is on another level above Eriksen because he's a better dribbler and can get round players easier but in reality they're both very good players who play in the same position but offer something different.

Oh yeah, and Vunipola is actually pretty fat. Hence why Faletau's engine is a lot better and you don't see him huffing and puffing after 50mins.

 

[E17yid]

Bit harsh to say he's been poor for Bath when he's been injured for a lot of the season and by all accounts his recent form has been good for them. A hatrick against Gloucester (up against Moriarty) and received a lot of plaudits, it would seem, when they beat Leicester last month.

Forgot to mention faletau's better all round game extends to him being a decent line out option as well whereas Vunipola not so much.

 

[FMA]

Oh yeah, and Vunipola is actually pretty fat. Hence why Faletau's engine is a lot better and you don't see him huffing and puffing after 50mins.

Used to be the case, not so much now.

 

[E17yid]

Used to be the case, not so much now.

Yeah to be fair he's dropped a few kilos. Was a bit tongue on cheek.

I like him and think Gatland would've started him as he suits his style (though personally I think bringing him on at 50/60mins against the all blacks would've been better)

Don't matter now though. He's a big loss. Personally thought he'd call up Heaslip but happy enough with Haskell.

 

[Japhet]

I would rather have taken Hughes as a like for like replacement to Billy, or even taken Launchbury and used Itoje in the back row.

 

[teok]

Check out this ridiculous barbarians team:


15 Alex Goode (Saracens & England) 21 caps
14 Timoci Nagusa (Montpellier & Fiji) 24
13 Yann David (Toulouse & France) 4
12 Frans Steyn (Montpellier & South Africa) 53
11 Adam Ashley-Cooper (Bordeaux-Begles & Australia) 116
10 Ian Madigan (Bordeaux-Begles & Ireland) 30
9 Kahn Fotuali’i (Bath Rugby & Samoa) 31
1 Mikheil Nariashvili (Montpellier & Georgia) 41
2 Richard Hibbard (Gloucester & Wales) 41
3 Census Johnston (Toulouse & Samoa) 59
4 Patricio Albacete (Toulouse & Argentina) 57
5 Jeremy Thrush (Gloucester & New Zealand)12
6 Thierry Dusautoir (Toulouse & France, captain) 80
7 Steffon Armitage (Pau & England) 5
8 Facundo Isa (Lyon & Argentina) 25

Replacements

16 Schalk Brits (Saracens & South Africa) 10
17 Ben Franks (London Irish & New Zealand) 47
18 WP Nel (Edinburgh & Scotland) 15
19 Joe Tekori (Toulouse & Samoa) 34
20 Gillian Galan (Toulouse)
21 Ruan Pienaar (Ulster & South Africa) 88
22 Robbie Fruean (Bath Rugby)
23 Horacio Agulla (Castres & Argentina) 63

 

[E17yid]

Check out this ridiculous barbarians team:


15 Alex Goode (Saracens & England) 21 caps
14 Timoci Nagusa (Montpellier & Fiji) 24
13 Yann David (Toulouse & France) 4
12 Frans Steyn (Montpellier & South Africa) 53
11 Adam Ashley-Cooper (Bordeaux-Begles & Australia) 116
10 Ian Madigan (Bordeaux-Begles & Ireland) 30
9 Kahn Fotuali’i (Bath Rugby & Samoa) 31
1 Mikheil Nariashvili (Montpellier & Georgia) 41
2 Richard Hibbard (Gloucester & Wales) 41
3 Census Johnston (Toulouse & Samoa) 59
4 Patricio Albacete (Toulouse & Argentina) 57
5 Jeremy Thrush (Gloucester & New Zealand)12
6 Thierry Dusautoir (Toulouse & France, captain) 80
7 Steffon Armitage (Pau & England) 5
8 Facundo Isa (Lyon & Argentina) 25

Replacements

16 Schalk Brits (Saracens & South Africa) 10
17 Ben Franks (London Irish & New Zealand) 47
18 WP Nel (Edinburgh & Scotland) 15
19 Joe Tekori (Toulouse & Samoa) 34
20 Gillian Galan (Toulouse)
21 Ruan Pienaar (Ulster & South Africa) 88
22 Robbie Fruean (Bath Rugby)
23 Horacio Agulla (Castres & Argentina) 63

Not bad.

We'll probably call up another 10 players by the time the first test comes around.

If we can win 1 test that would be a success imo.

 

[nightgoat]

Check out this ridiculous barbarians team:


15 Alex Goode (Saracens & England) 21 caps
14 Timoci Nagusa (Montpellier & Fiji) 24
13 Yann David (Toulouse & France) 4
12 Frans Steyn (Montpellier & South Africa) 53
11 Adam Ashley-Cooper (Bordeaux-Begles & Australia) 116
10 Ian Madigan (Bordeaux-Begles & Ireland) 30
9 Kahn Fotuali’i (Bath Rugby & Samoa) 31
1 Mikheil Nariashvili (Montpellier & Georgia) 41
2 Richard Hibbard (Gloucester & Wales) 41
3 Census Johnston (Toulouse & Samoa) 59
4 Patricio Albacete (Toulouse & Argentina) 57
5 Jeremy Thrush (Gloucester & New Zealand)12
6 Thierry Dusautoir (Toulouse & France, captain) 80
7 Steffon Armitage (Pau & England) 5
8 Facundo Isa (Lyon & Argentina) 25

Replacements

16 Schalk Brits (Saracens & South Africa) 10
17 Ben Franks (London Irish & New Zealand) 47
18 WP Nel (Edinburgh & Scotland) 15
19 Joe Tekori (Toulouse & Samoa) 34
20 Gillian Galan (Toulouse)
21 Ruan Pienaar (Ulster & South Africa) 88
22 Robbie Fruean (Bath Rugby)
23 Horacio Agulla (Castres & Argentina) 63

8 uncapped players in the England team, a further 7 on the bench. Will be an interesting game, the Barbarians by their very nature are unpredictable and inconsisent and rarely play like the sum of their parts.

Also, sorry @E17yid, Sam Underhill's not switching to Wales any time soon now.

 

[E17yid]

8 uncapped players in the England team, a further 7 on the bench. Will be an interesting game, the Barbarians by their very nature are unpredictable and inconsisent and rarely play like the sum of their parts.

Also, sorry @E17yid, Sam Underhill's not switching to Wales any time soon now.

Yeah, that ship has sailed, unfortunately. Well, I say unfortunately, he was born in the states and has no Welsh parentage so would've been a bit of a blag to say, yeah, but he went to Cardiff uni.

 

[talkshowhost86]

Blimey that Baa Baas team may have a bit of a field day looking at the England line up.

Some of those England players don't even play regularly for their club team which is a bit worrying!

 

[E17yid]

Blimey that Baa Baas team may have a bit of a field day looking at the England line up.

Some of those England players don't even play regularly for their club team which is a bit worrying!

They're cutting their teeth though. The result shouldn't really matter too much.

 

[talkshowhost86]

They're cutting their teeth though. The result shouldn't really matter too much.

Absolutely, and the Argentina tour is perfect for them as they shouldn't get smashed.

Just impressed by the strength of that Baa Baas team. Not seen them gather that much quality for a while.

 

[SugarRay]

Massive loss for the Lions. Faletau is fine but not the same level as Billy and that's when he's actually on form which he hasn't been this year (partly down to injury).

I think this tour is going to get very messy for the Lions.

Different players. I was hoping to see Toby at 6 with Billy at 8. Right now, Billy is as good as any 8 in the game and is actually improving. Toby is a class act too, in a very different way. Both important players for their teams.

If it wasn't for a fairly large English contingent, I'd be hopeful that it gets messy for the Lions! I still might yet when the first test line up is revealed! I think the Lions has had its day personally.

 

[talkshowhost86]

Different players. I was hoping to see Toby at 6 with Billy at 8. Right now, Billy is as good as any 8 in the game and is actually improving. Toby is a class act too, in a very different way. Both important players for their teams.

If it wasn't for a fairly large English contingent, I'd be hopeful that it gets messy for the Lions! I still might yet when the first test line up is revealed! I think the Lions has had its day personally.

Yeah I was talking about the comparison between them at no.8 rather than any other position, and Faletau would be a good option at 6.

I think it's clear that Gats took him as the backup no.8 though, and the fact that we haven't called up a proper 8 as a replacement suggests we'll now be starting with either Faletau or Stander there.

Not quite sure what we then do in the mid-week games but I suppose they are a lesser concern anyway.

If we were going to not replace Billy with a proper no.8 though I really don't understand why we've gone for Haskell over Robshaw, other than the fact that Haskell will make the behind the scenes DVD a bit more interesting.

 

[SugarRay]

Stander doesn't have the physicality to beast a primed and raring to go All Blacks on their home patch. They'll lap that approach up all day. It's why Gatland has never come close to beating them. They laugh off that type of game plan. Billy was the only man in the squad who would have troubled them in terms of ball carrying imo.

I'd 100% go with a SOB, Warburton, Falateu back row given Billy's injury.

Kruis and Itoje locking down, Two Irish props with Jamie George sandwiched between them. AWJ and Mako to come on and throw their weight about.

 

[talkshowhost86]

Incredible final in the Premiership today. Well played Exeter but what an effort from both teams. A proper advert for club rugby.

In the Pro 12 though Munster are currently choking badly. Magnificent from the Scarlets though.