Antonio Nusa

JamieSpursCommunityUser · Jan 29, 2024

JamieSpursCommunityUser said:
Thanks for the ITK.

Which ever way we want to spin it, we're being out bid by Brentford and Brighton to a key target.

Our approach now is to gain interest from the targeted player, and use that buy in to try to dictate terms.

The problem is the market is too competitive and dynamic to ever have that control.

This approach very nearly cost us the Dragusin deal.

Plenty to be positive about our club at the moment, but without Paratici leading negotiations my fear is we're going back to the bad habits of Dear Leader.

- Summer deadline day pulling plugs on CBs.
- Sanchez sale after deadline without replacement.
- Dragging our feet to the squeeze the pips this window, and being gazumped by Brentford.

I'm not convinced any of that happens with Paratici steering the ship, and I think Nusa would probably be our player.

SpursSince1980 said:
Lots of assumptions here, buddy. I know Dear Leader is to blame for all ills and sins, but not sure anyone is to blame here. This decision was down to the player by the sounds of it. Hard to go full ‘burn baldy to the ground’ over this. But, I respect how you feel.

In the past I've acknowledged Levy's credit for hiring Paratici and Ange in the first place. No pitch forks here.

But many of the takes on Nusa and also the clubs actions and journo briefings seem full of contradictions to me.

1. To paraphrase others. "We didn't match their bid and nor should we" - and yet "the player chose Brentford, not our fault."

The player can't have chosen Brentford if we didn't match the bid. There was no longer a choice?

2. We're trying to convince the player that he's an important signing with a big future here - and yet get outgunned by a club with 1/5 of our turnover.

Demonstrating to Nusa that he's more important to them, whislt we lacked the conviction of our own strategy.

3. Our strategy is to buy players before they become superstars. Having great success when Fab closed deals for Udogie, Sarr etc. And yet when one of if not THE biggest prospect in Europe is available, we baulk over 5m Euros.

So what is our strategy now exactly? How do we replace Kane and Son in 1-2 years?

There are other good players. I have no doubts we'll identify them. But what's the point if we lack the courage of our convictions?

Surely to dare is not to get gazumped by Brentford.

mil1lion · Jan 29, 2024

JamieSpursCommunityUser said:
In the past I've acknowledged Levy's credit for hiring Paratici and Ange in the first place. No pitch forks here.

But many of the takes on Nusa and also the clubs actions and journo briefings seem full of contradictions to me.

1. To paraphrase others. "We didn't match their bid and nor should we" - and yet "the player chose Brentford, not our fault."

The player can't have chosen Brentford if we didn't match the bid. There was no longer a choice?

2. We're trying to convince the player that he's an important signing with a big future here - and yet get outgunned by a club with 1/5 of our turnover.

Demonstrating to Nusa that he's more important to them, whislt we lacked the conviction of our own strategy.

3. Our strategy is to buy players before they become superstars. Having great success when Fab closed deals for Udogie, Sarr etc. And yet when one of if not THE biggest prospect in Europe is available, we baulk over 5m Euros.

So what is our strategy now exactly? How do we replace Kane and Son in 1-2 years?

There are other good players. I have no doubts we'll identify them. But what's the point if we lack the courage of our convictions?

Surely to dare is not to get gazumped by Brentford.

Sarr was around 15m
Udogie will be up to 20m
They want around 30m plus a fair bit of sell on as well

That's too steep for an unproven. Is he honestly worth that much more than Sarr or Udogie coming from a weaker league?

McFlash · Jan 29, 2024

JamieSpursCommunityUser said:
Surely to dare is not to get gazumped by Brentford.

We didn't really get gazumped by Brentford though, did we?

Brugge did what they should and played the market, driving the price above what we considered him worth.

Brentford have decided that they will pay that and will also agree to a pretty hefty sell-on fee, something we never do.
We've not been gazumped in any way, we just had a sniff and when things started to get silly, walked away.
Same as we did with Raya, and whatshisface that we were talking about before we signed Dragusin.

If anything, I rather approve of us sticking to our guns and refusing to get drawn into a bidding war.
We don't want to become Man United and get a reputation of over-paying, I'd much rather clubs realise that we won't be messed about.

HildoSpur · Jan 29, 2024

mil1lion said:
Sarr was around 15m
Udogie will be up to 20m
They want around 30m plus a fair bit of sell on as well

That's too steep for an unproven. Is he honestly worth that much more than Sarr or Udogie coming from a weaker league?

I get what you are saying but attacking players go for a premium as we know so you would expect to pay considerably more.

Japhet · Jan 29, 2024

ikky said:
You win some and lose some. We won with Dragusin and lost with Nusa. Out of the 2 I know which win I prefer more.

We won with Dragusin after we seemingly lost out on Todibo. We won with Van de Ven after we seemingly lost out on Tapsoba. Hopefully something equally exciting happens now that we've lost out on Nusa.

ssamme · Jan 29, 2024

Japhet said:
We won with Dragusin after we seemingly lost out on Todibo. We won with Van de Ven after we seemingly lost out on Tapsoba. Hopefully something equally exciting happens now that we've lost out on Nusa.

Mickey Moore

Guernman · Jan 29, 2024

Our strategy is to improve the squad to make us competitive. Sometimes that will include buying for the future but mostly we need players who are going to have an immediate impact. Udogie was loaned back, but boy he has made an incredible and immediate impact since he arrived.

We will know what a player is worth, and sometimes we will be willing to pay more to get the deal done. We did for Dragusin. But that was a position we needed to fill, and he is a great prospect who makes us much stronger immediately.

Ange wants to improve our forward line, but Werner was always going to make a much bigger impact this season than Nusa even if we got him this window.

Every 5 million we over pay affects the budget. We can't always do that, especially when we would have to wait years to really reap the benefits. Ange only has years if he remains successful.

I think Brentford are taking a huge risk here, but they are also looking to buy players with a view to selling them, we are not. If the player sees himself at Real Madrid a few years from now, then Brentford offers something we don't. Because Ange demands that any player who comes really wants to play for Spurs - and the likes of Udogie and Sarr see their futures here, it's why they have both signed new long term contracts.

It is unlikely that Nusa would right now, so it makes perfect sense for an 18 year old Scandinavian player looking for the next stage in his development to be enticed by Frank and Brentford, where he will play more, improve and move on. If that's what he wants, they are a better fit and we move on

JamieSpursCommunityUser · Jan 29, 2024

mil1lion said:
Sarr was around 15m
Udogie will be up to 20m
They want around 30m plus a fair bit of sell on as well

That's too steep for an unproven. Is he honestly worth that much more than Sarr or Udogie coming from a weaker league?

The price I believe is £31.5m including add-ons.

The fact they're getting it from a MUCH smaller PL club demonstrates where the market is.

We paid that for Moussa Sissoko in 2016 prices.

We paid £25m + Lamela for Gil.

We paid £47m for Johnson with a much more limited skill set. One so much coaching can do about that (though I still back him).

Nusa is proven at CL and International level, Sarr and Udogie were arguably not much more proven if at all.

Any player capable of replacing Son will cost £70-100m+, much bigger wages, AND likely have bigger suitors than us.

Not every signing we make, especially one aimed to complete our starting XI, is going to be a bargain.

Where we can be costs efficient, great, where we can't just build the team with the best players you can get.

Again Nusa isn't the only player, but it's still a huge miss and one I fear we'll regret as we did Kvara.

razor1981 · Jan 29, 2024

JamieSpursCommunityUser said:
The price I believe is £31.5m including add-ons.

The fact they're getting it from a MUCH smaller PL club demonstrates where the market is.

We paid that for Moussa Sissoko in 2016 prices.

We paid £25m + Lamela for Gil.

We paid £47m for Johnson with a much more limited skill set. One so much coaching can do about that (though I still back him).

Nusa is proven at CL and International level, Sarr and Udogie were arguably not much more proven if at all.

Any player capable of replacing Son will cost £70-100m+, much bigger wages, AND likely have bigger suitors than us.

Not every signing we make, especially one aimed to complete our starting XI, is going to be a bargain.

Where we can be costs efficient, great, where we can't just build the team with the best players you can get.

Again Nusa isn't the only player, but it's still a huge miss and one I fear we'll regret as we did Kvara.

He's played 55 mins in the Champions League and 129 mins for Norway. Hardly "proven" at either level.

JamieSpursCommunityUser · Jan 29, 2024

McFlash said:
We didn't really get gazumped by Brentford though, did we?

Brugge did what they should and played the market, driving the price above what we considered him worth.

Brentford have decided that they will pay that and will also agree to a pretty hefty sell-on fee, something we never do.
We've not been gazumped in any way, we just had a sniff and when things started to get silly, walked away.
Same as we did with Raya, and whatshisface that we were talking about before we signed Dragusin.

If anything, I rather approve of us sticking to our guns and refusing to get drawn into a bidding war.
We don't want to become Man United and get a reputation of over-paying, I'd much rather clubs realise that we won't be messed about.

LWF is the last position in our starting XI that's seriously up for grabs, before replacing Son at CF in 6-18 months time.

Brentford were willing to put down more than we were to get the player (with 20% of our turnover).

We weren't Gazumped by the infinite pockets of an oil club. But by a team with the same strategy as us, but with greater confidence and conviction in their own player ID.

It's not great is it?

FYI Lloris had a 10% sell on clause from Lyon, as have lots of our signings. It's not uncommon for us or most teams, just didn't use to get forensically reported as it is in the Twitter / Romano age.

Misfit · Jan 29, 2024

Honestly, I didn't expect anything to come from the Sarr or Udogie when they happened. We've struck gold twice now but that's a rarity.

£30m+ and a sell-on fee for someone with less experience than either of them. Would have been interesting to see but I can't blame the club for not being drawn into that.

Maybe had we just agree for him to stay at Bruges for the rest of this season and got the deal wrapped up a week ago this would all be moot but we didn't.

JamieSpursCommunityUser · Jan 29, 2024

razor1981 said:
He's played 55 mins in the Champions League and 129 mins for Norway. Hardly "proven" at either level.

How many CL minutes had Sarr played?

Anyone who watched his Norway debut could see he was a player. Including Haaland.

And if you don't want to take my word for it, Ange and the scouting structure identified him as one to go for.

Paratici has been putting in the ground work in the way he does for special talent.

Again it's not a total disaster, we're capable of getting someone good eventually, but it's a big miss.

Getting someone better will be much much more expensive imo.

JamieSpursCommunityUser · Jan 29, 2024

guernman said:
Our strategy is to improve the squad to make us competitive. Sometimes that will include buying for the future but mostly we need players who are going to have an immediate impact. Udogie was loaned back, but boy he has made an incredible and immediate impact since he arrived.

We will know what a player is worth, and sometimes we will be willing to pay more to get the deal done. We did for Dragusin. But that was a position we needed to fill, and he is a great prospect who makes us much stronger immediately.

Ange wants to improve our forward line, but Werner was always going to make a much bigger impact this season than Nusa even if we got him this window.

Every 5 million we over pay affects the budget. We can't always do that, especially when we would have to wait years to really reap the benefits. Ange only has years if he remains successful.

I think Brentford are taking a huge risk here, but they are also looking to buy players with a view to selling them, we are not. If the player sees himself at Real Madrid a few years from now, then Brentford offers something we don't. Because Ange demands that any player who comes really wants to play for Spurs - and the likes of Udogie and Sarr see their futures here, it's why they have both signed new long term contracts.

It is unlikely that Nusa would right now, so it makes perfect sense for an 18 year old Scandinavian player looking for the next stage in his development to be enticed by Frank and Brentford, where he will play more, improve and move on. If that's what he wants, they are a better fit and we move on

Nusa would get into our team very quickly given the lack of guile up front.

Which is probably why Ange wanted him now.

Otherwise why blow up the deal if he wouldn't have played him?

It doesn't make any sense.

McFlash · Jan 29, 2024

JamieSpursCommunityUser said:
FYI Lloris had a 10% sell on clause from Lyon, as have lots of our signings. It's not uncommon for us or most teams, just didn't use to get forensically reported as it is in the Twitter / Romano age.

I still say that we weren't gazumped at all, we walked away.

And with regards to Hugo (maybe) having a sell on, we're a much different club now than we were back then.
I honestly can't remember any players we've signed with sell-on clauses and like release clauses, they're just not something that Levy will entertain.
He thinks we should be seen as a big club and big clubs don't agree to such clauses.

alfiemacdaddy · Jan 29, 2024

JamieSpursCommunityUser said:
Nusa would get into our team very quickly given the lack of guile up front.

Which is probably why Ange wanted him now.

Otherwise why blow up the deal if he wouldn't have played him?

It doesn't make any sense.

Nah

mil1lion · Jan 29, 2024

HildoSpur said:
I get what you are saying but attacking players go for a premium as we know so you would expect to pay considerably more.

Not necessarily. Ndombele, Romero, Sissoko and Sanchez are among our largest transfers. We can't just pay a premium because they're an attacker. We have to factor everything in and decide if they're worth the cost. This one just reminds me of Orban, maybe ok up to a price but then if it gets too much move on.

JamieSpursCommunityUser · Jan 29, 2024

McFlash said:
I still say that we weren't gazumped at all, we walked away.

Call it what we like. We didn't get him because a smaller team with a fraction of our budget were prepared to outbid us.

And not a team with a reputation for reckless stupidity in the market, quite the opposite.

McFlash said:
And with regards to Hugo (maybe) having a sell on, we're a much different club now than we were back then.
I honestly can't remember any players we've signed with sell-on clauses and like release clauses, they're just not something that Levy will entertain.
He thinks we should be seen as a big club and big clubs don't agree to such clauses.

Veliz has a 10% sell on clause.

Hojbjerg too I believe.

It's quite common for us, just not as valuable to the seller as we're less likely to sell him for profit than Brentford.

ComfortablyNumb · Jan 29, 2024

McFlash said:
I still say that we weren't gazumped at all, we walked away.

And with regards to Hugo (maybe) having a sell on, we're a much different club now than we were back then.
I honestly can't remember any players we've signed with sell-on clauses and like release clauses, they're just not something that Levy will entertain.
He thinks we should be seen as a big club and big clubs don't agree to such clauses.

Gazumped is exactly what we were. We made an offer that we thought was accepted, someone offered more and got the deal. It's not a bad thing, we should never pay more than our valuation for anything. But you can't say we weren't gazumped.

npearl4spurs · Jan 29, 2024

Don't worry. We'll get him in a couple years time with Alex Scott at B'mouth after we've won the league and whatever other trophies

alfiemacdaddy · Jan 29, 2024

ComfortablyNumb said:
Gazumped is exactly what we were. We made an offer that we thought was accepted, someone offered more and got the deal. It's not a bad thing, we should never pay more than our valuation for anything. But you can't say we weren't gazumped.

Gazumping implies we have neither the time nor the money to increase our offer to match or better Brentford’s. We have both but we have chosen not to. There’s a difference

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