Winners ... we need winners

tiger666 said:

This whole "winning mentality" thing is lazy journo talk.

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As is we need to win a trophy else the whole club will fall apart and fall into the conference. We are performing above par on the whole.

shelfboy68 said:

It would be nice if we can get out of the CL group stage after the disaster last time around, as for the end of the season the last couple of games we really expressed ourselves as the title was gone so the pressure was off, when the pressure was cranked up at west ham we sort of got the result we expected.
I don't see us getting CL next season but if we did whilst playing at Wembley they may even represent better qualification than this season just gone.

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So weren't we under pressure when we beat Palace, Swansea (we were 1-0 down with 10 mins to go) Burnley away etc...just because we lost to a team who played their cup final doesn't mean we buckled under pressure.

Fergie took 5 years to win his first trophy,,,FA Cup
We are ahead of his schedule!
We will get there keep the faith.
We are doing it organically, the right (hard) way, we have an incredibly bright future!
CIES valued our team at over €900m with the board investment into the stadium and training ground and other ancillary works
we have another £1b going into the club on top.
Our match day revenue will top £100m in the next 18 months and probably before.(same as Utd and Arsenal)
Our TV revenue this last season will be in excess of £175m including Euro footie
our commercial revenue for 15/16 was £60m, and I am sure we are going to smash that over the next couple of years.
Our borrowings are an average of 2.4% on £300m of which only 100 has been drawn down.


The source for this is our year end accounts March 17.
The match day revenue comparison was Deloitte Jan 17
Finally comparing apples with apples the goons spent 450m on their stadium 12 years ago when interest rates were much higher
(7-10%) and revenues were a fraction of what they are today. Think back to the size of TV deals 12 years ago. They were tiny
I know a lot of people out there do not like or trust Levy, I do I honestly think that our team off the pitch are every bit as good as the team on it, if not better.
By the time we are in our new stadium revenues will be going towards £400-500m (as long as we continue to do ok on the pitch)
The Tottenham giant is slowly waking up. It is capable of matching most if not all our rivals. Most importantly, it will do it in a sustainable way, unlike the MAN C and Chelsea way.
Yes Wembley is a risk, but not the enormous one others perceive, our owner is in the top richest 250 people on the planet today.
(worth$5.7B).
The Spurs rocket is leaving the launchpad, sit back and enjoy the ride! The success on the pitch is not a blip, we are no longer a one or even 2 season wonder.
Trophies will come, this whole thing has not happened by accident. With a bit of luck re injuries, and Had chelsea been in europe this year, with the complications that brings, we could already, have had our first one.
Think about it, the margins were very fine in the FA cup, on another day the Kane shot under the body goes in, and Rose at left back, with a fit Lamela winks etc could ve been a very different story

If Chelsea had last years season this year we'd have won the league and maybe the double, perhaps if we bought Christiano Ronaldo we might have done anyway, he's a winner, or that Messi bloke he's a winner too, they also happen to be great players with bags of experiemce so maybe that's what we want. Maybe we could raid the Newcastle squad they are winners or that Theo Walcott bloke, he's a winner, ooh ooh I know, what about that Okazaki geyzer he's a winner too or possibly Poch out Martinez in, he's a winner you know.
As it happens Liverpool is the only team against whom we weren't winners this season and by this time next year we'll have a team of winners with a trophy to show for it.

Gbspurs said:

Nothing I saw at the end of the season suggested we Iacked winners.

The only issue we have is Poch's teams don't seem to hit their stride until Christmas.

That said this time last season we were bemoaning poor finishes from Poch's teams and he worked that one out so fingers crossed.

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So why didn't we win the Europa League or the FA cup, which were both won by inferior teams?

Ironskullll said:

Out of interest, who are the 'winners' in the Chelsea, Arsenal and Man Utd squads who have made the difference?

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Strange question. There are lots of obvious winners in all those teams. Ibra, for chrissake. Sanchez, Ozil. David Luiz, Kante. etc etc etc.

mendesstormer said:

Strange question. There are lots of obvious winners in all those teams. Ibra, for chrissake. Sanchez, Ozil. David Luiz, Kante. etc etc etc.

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Do you mean "winners" or simply "good players"?

absolute bobbins said:

Huth, Morgan, Vardy, Drinkwater.

Oh and this winners thing, nonsense. It comes from journalists, it is based on their supposition and let's face it, if these people were psychologists, they would be sitting in the stands watching the match not having to write about it whilst getting paid peanuts.

Expand it out into any other sport or aspect of life and see if it holds true.

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I disagree completely. You only have to recall the shift in our attitude when Edgar Davids joined us. A similar effect when VDV joined too. Neither of those signings resulted in trophies of course, but they would have had a psychological effect on the squad.

It holds true in other sports too. Even snooker players, tennis players, and boxers look to surround themselves with people who have a winning mentality and experience.

I'd say a mental shift took place when Leicester signed Cambiasso. It's important to have those kind of players in and around the squad. Certainly not essential, but I'd say it's useful.

Tucker said:

Quoted these for truth.

We have a great team, maybe one of THE great teams. As they gain more and more experience the trophies will come, if we keep them together somehow they could be amazing and very successful.

Besides we have loads of winners in our team. Eriksen, Vertonghen, and Toby have all won league titles with Ajax. Do the not count, simply because they won a title in another country?

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C.mon. You could make a long list of fairly ordinary players who've won an Eredivisie medal. It's clearly not the same as winning La Liga, The World Cup or the Premier League, for example.

danielneeds said:

We make too many mistakes in big matches. That is an experience
thing. You can either buy some grizzled veterens to remedy it, or grow this team organically.

We learned from the end of last season, and we will learn from the mistakes in the CL, the semi final again this campaign.

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Exactly, we are learning from them, and more importantly we have a coach who is learning from them too. I would much rather this team grow organically the way it is rather than upset the team ethos and spirit by bringing in some mercenaries!

tiger666 said:

Do you mean "winners" or simply "good players"?

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No I mean winners. They all have experience of winning major titles. We're not short of good players, that much is obvious.

mattyspurs said:

Exactly, we are learning from them, and more importantly we have a coach who is learning from them too. I would much rather this team grow organically the way it is rather than upset the team ethos and spirit by bringing in some mercenaries!

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They don't need to be mercenaries though, do they? Edgar Davids wasn't a mercenary. Nor was VDV. Gallas, maybe, but he still made a positive contribution.

Older players who don't fit with our transfer strategy ... we need older players who don't fit with our transfer strategy.

Poch and Tottenham are a match made in heaven because he creates and moulds players. He clearly has a winning mentality and so do our players. We need a bit more, quality depth and we will be absolutely fine. We have some ridiculously experienced young players who've played together for a number of years, very few clubs can boast that.

So to everyone who thinks the whole 'winners' thing is bullshit, why is that Man U can breeze through the Europa League at virtually their first attempt and we can't seem to get anywhere near it?

mendesstormer said:

So to everyone who thinks the whole 'winners' thing is bullshit, why is that Man U can breeze through the Europa League at virtually their first attempt and we can't seem to get anywhere near it?

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The finished 24 points off the leaders...they threw the league in order to focus on winning the EL.

mendesstormer said:

So to everyone who thinks the whole 'winners' thing is bullshit, why is that Man U can breeze through the Europa League at virtually their first attempt and we can't seem to get anywhere near it?

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You talk as though it's West Brom. You've seen some of the players United have right? Also as much as I hate him and his tactics, Mourinho is a great manager at what he does. They gave up on the league at the end too.

mendesstormer said:

So two very mediocre teams, have ended the season with three trophies between them. Spurs, who according to most neutrals are a far superior team at the moment, have ended with none. Arsenal put in probably their best performance of the season, especially considering their missing players, just when they needed it most. Whereas we let our level drop against Chelsea at the crucial moment (in the semi). Man U pretty much strolled through the Europa League. Whereas we have notably failed to make any significant impact on the competition in, what, about 8 or 10 attempts?

Would I swap with either of them? Probably not. We have a far better squad and, crucially, a far better team spirit than either of the aforementioned. We also have a great manager, who is learning all the time. But that steep learning curve needs to continue. Next season we have to win silverware, if this team is not to go unremembered by history.

What will it take? Apart from Poch becoming a little bit cuter and knowing how and when to get a performance out of the team when it really matters? Probably the addition of a couple of 'winners' to the squad. Our young players are hungry, and they don't lack self-belief, but none of them have really won anything before, and it's beginning to show. I'd love to see someone like Danni Alves, and even more so, Isco or Iniesta (we can dream). I think it's highly unlikely we'd get any of them, but this is the calibre of player we need most at this point in our development. Any slightly more realistic suggestions?

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Yes I agree its annoying. United are shite and have won 4 cups in 2 years. Arsenal fans are going nuts and they have won 3 FA cups in 4 years.

The main problem is their wage bills are more than double ours. So they can compete in more competitions where as we have to prioritise.

We can throw on Sissoko and GKN, they have Martial, Lingaard, Rooney, Mata etc...

Our new stadium will address this issue. We just need a bigger squad. Which boils down to a higher wage bill.

tiger666 said:

You talk as though it's West Brom. You've seen some of the players United have right? Also as much as I hate him and his tactics, Mourinho is a great manager at what he does. They gave up on the league at the end too.

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Exactly. They have some winners in their squad. And Mourinho. Who, much as I dislike the man, is also a winner. Poch might turn out to be a winner too. I'm just suggesting he could use a bit of onfield help. Can't see why this point is contentious.

mendesstormer said:

Exactly. They have some winners in their squad. And Mourinho. Who, much as I dislike the man, is also a winner. Poch might turn out to be a winner too. I'm just suggesting he could use a bit of onfield help. Can't see why this point is contentious.

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See, I don't see what this magical "winning mentality" thing is. I see a team with very good players, a very good manager who tactically played well. I wouldn't say Leicester have a winning mentality, nor Wigan.

If Janssen had scored a few goals in October and we won the league, do we all suddenly have a winning mentality because he scored a few?