Spurs Squad - Evolution over the Transfer Window

Spursidol · Aug 30, 2014

More on Taider from a journo covering Southampton, which is probably the final nail in the MS transfer

Simon Peach ‏@SimonPeach
Saphir Taider is packing his bags after just 23 days at #SaintsFC. I am told his season-long loan from Inter is to be cancelled.

Simon Peach ‏@SimonPeach
Taider is understood to have failed to fit in with the group & manager Ronald Koeman's work ethic. Best for both parties.

Simon Peach ‏@SimonPeach
The early termination of the Taider loan does not impact Osvaldo's deal at #Inter. He won't be returning to #SaintsFC as a result.

dontcallme · Aug 30, 2014

As others have said it's been a good window based on keeping our best players. Very encouraging to see Lloris commit to staying and hopefully Vertonghen will sign a new contract shortly.

What has been encouraging as well is Poch giving the current players a chance. He didn't just come in and want to bring in all his own players.

Anyone who saw Rose play for Sunderland would have seen a good left back so I've been bemused at how negative people have been towards him. Davies is a pragmatic signing and we now have good cover and competition for that spot.

Lamela looks absolutely determined to make it big and I see a big season for him. Good to see Poch giving Ade a central role as at his best he's a really good striker.

Spursidol · Aug 30, 2014

@jetsetyid quick question..how many do you expect in?

The original JJetset ‏@jetsetyid 2 more (maybe loans) after bs (nb. the new DM from Montpellier)

Spursidol · Aug 30, 2014

The original JJetset ‏@jetsetyid @MilkyBarY1d @Spursidol we are in for DW but if that falls through we have a few options

Spursidol · Aug 30, 2014

Looks like this TW is turning out to be bigger than I thought it would be - already 5 in (including DeAndre Yedlin) and another three mooted - another cm, provisionally identified as the Montpellier dm and a wide forward, who may be Danny Welbeck or another and maybe a 3rd (JJ talking about BS and two others, in).

Rumbaldo · Aug 30, 2014

Fantastic idea for a thread spursidol.
Breaking things down like this make alot of our decisions seem more rational namely the pursuit of j-rod and morgan (as HG players). Really enjoyed reading this and hope you will repeat this format in future windows.

Spursidol · Aug 30, 2014

Rumbaldo said:
Fantastic idea for a thread spursidol.
Breaking things down like this make alot of our decisions seem more rational namely the pursuit of j-rod and morgan (as HG players). Really enjoyed reading this and hope you will repeat this format in future windows.

Thanks

IMO, the transfer section has changed to catering for the itk 'surprise look who we are signing' and 'wish list of players' type SC'ers, whereas IMO there's quite a few who enjoy a more rational analytical approach of 'wjt type of player' do we need approach - and that in turn allows us to assess the likeliehood of certain ITK being likely - and also the likely players exiting.

I'm sure we could improve on the thread, but at least the OP has all the players on with various club/other FA/overseas categories on whivh is a start - so all suggestions for improvement welcome.

Tricky bit with Poch is to really understand the type of players he wanted - but I think that's become reasonably clear..

stemark44 · Aug 30, 2014

One thing that I think has evolved over this window and something I am all for, is our desire to bring in guys in our defensive area,who play with great determination.
Dier looks like a young guy who is really up for it and from the little I have watched of both Fazio and Stambouli,these guys really don't take any prisoners.

Spursidol · Aug 30, 2014

stemark44 said:
One thing that I think has evolved over this window and something I am all for, is our desire to bring in guys in our defensive area,who play with great determination.
Dier looks like a young guy who is really up for it and from the little I have watched of both Fazio and Stambouli,these guys really don't take any prisoners.

Good point. Wonder if that is because Poch has replaced Dawson and is lining up a replacement for Kaboul - so we have 2 cultured ball playing CB's (Vertonghen & Chorches) and needed to bring in the 'harder' CB type - although Dier certainly can usethe ball too and Fazio has a reputation for doing so - and from the little I can find on Stamboul he's a hard man who can pass too.

Spursidol · Aug 30, 2014

http://www.getfootballnewsfrance.com/2014/benjamin-stambouli-will-be-in-london-tomorrow/

Rumbaldo · Aug 30, 2014

Spursidol said:
the transfer section has changed to catering for the itk 'surprise look who we are signing' and 'wish list of players' type SC'ers,

This.
Don't get me wrong I love to read the speculation as much as everyone else but the info in the OP serves as a bit of a guide to the madness and an excellent resources to dampen the fervent desire to add TEN MILLION PLAYERS FROM THE LATEST IN VOGUE COUNTRY!!!
I confess before a ball had even been kicked this season i was a little disenfranchised by our preference to buying players with premiership experience (read inflated fees) above the exotic imports i have grown accustomed to. Where i got this impression i couldn't tell you but it was my expectation. Had i seen our squad in the way you have presented it and digested that information I would have understood the need to secure some home grown options.

As it turns out the makeup of the squad hasn't changed that much in terms of our home grown numbers but i expect once we have steadied the ship a little after the debacle that was last season the club will look to address the balance. If only to give us a bit of breathing room in the future - its not sensible to be holding so many non HG cards because it means we need to sell before we can sensibly bring in any upgrades from overseas. Chelsea and such don't seem to care but we have to be more canny and resourceful than those nouveau riche clubs.

I also wonder if the club have some scheme to get Dier exemption from the 'overseas' category before he hits 21, there must be an angle somewhere. The rule was seemingly designed to benefit the development of homegrown players/ the respective national team yet next season the rule will be working against Dier. As a simpleton I believe if a player is registered for a nation and playing in that nations league the club and the player should not be penalised for him seeking a different path in his youth development. On the contrary i believe it should be encouraged and celebrated especially by the poxy FA in the premier league if not by Uefa across continental competitions.

Lastly i found an excellent article (CLICK HERE) about the retreat of the club trained player I would love to see how we fair in this going forward.

Edit: if that link requires you to register to read and you cba pm me

Spursidol · Aug 31, 2014

Rumbaldo said:
This.
Don't get me wrong I love to read the speculation as much as everyone else but the info in the OP serves as a bit of a guide to the madness and an excellent resources to dampen the fervent desire to add TEN MILLION PLAYERS FROM THE LATEST IN VOGUE COUNTRY!!!
I confess before a ball had even been kicked this season i was a little disenfranchised by our preference to buying players with premiership experience (read inflated fees) above the exotic imports i have grown accustomed to. Where i got this impression i couldn't tell you but it was my expectation. Had i seen our squad in the way you have presented it and digested that information I would have understood the need to secure some home grown options.

As it turns out the makeup of the squad hasn't changed that much in terms of our home grown numbers but i expect once we have steadied the ship a little after the debacle that was last season the club will look to address the balance. If only to give us a bit of breathing room in the future - its not sensible to be holding so many non HG cards because it means we need to sell before we can sensibly bring in any upgrades from overseas. Chelsea and such don't seem to care but we have to be more canny and resourceful than those nouveau riche clubs.

I also wonder if the club have some scheme to get Dier exemption from the 'overseas' category before he hits 21, there must be an angle somewhere. The rule was seemingly designed to benefit the development of homegrown players/ the respective national team yet next season the rule will be working against Dier. As a simpleton I believe if a player is registered for a nation and playing in that nations league the club and the player should not be penalised for him seeking a different path in his youth development. On the contrary i believe it should be encouraged and celebrated especially by the poxy FA in the premier league if not by Uefa across continental competitions.

Lastly i found an excellent article (CLICK HERE) about the retreat of the club trained player I would love to see how we fair in this going forward.

Edit: if that link requires you to register to read and you cba pm me

Agreed the ITK speculation can be fun - but I also like to understand the 'hows' and why' of why certain players are being bought - other than they are/should be good players - and hence the OP

Re the highlighted bit, I thimk the rules were brought in with England in mind by FA (not dissimilsr to rules in other EU countries) but in order to conform with EU law they could not categorise any certain nation/country, but only the country in which the player received their training from a young age. I'd love to think you are right and I'm sure Spurs will give the dea some thought but I suspect that EU law will defeat any atempt, unless the rules are changed so that it becomes 'any 3 year period from the age of 4 that the player trained in a country' (I sem to recall that the young Dier moved to Portugal aged 7 or so) - rather than it being a 3 year period from the age of 15 as at present.

Looking forward, outside the u21's listed on OP, the most likely youngsters (who are likely to be categorised as 'Club trained' at age 21) to be assessed as to whether they can break through to the first team squad (and not on loan currently are :

Dominic Ball - England u20 CB
Alex McQueen - RB/LB/CB/RM
Ruben Lameiras - AM/no 10 (ironically moved to UK as a youngster and has represented Portugal, but would be likely to be HG under current rules)

However a more exciting group is the age group below :

Connor Ogilvie - LB/CB
Harry Winks - CM (in Poch's mould - good passing, good defensive qualities and covers every blade of grass )
Nathan Oduwa - Left/Right wing forward

There are a couple more who might also make it through from that age group, and the 2 or 3 age group below that looks to have probably 3 or 4 very good candidates in each year group who realistically might break though.

So at the moment whilst the 'club trained' player may be under threat I'm hoping that Spurs youngsters can buck the trend - and within 5 or so years to have half the squad as being 'Club Trained'

So if we can get Poch to blood a few youngsters each year (plus with judicious loans) , then we should be able to get a number through into the first team squad - which in turn means that we can focus our cash on buying the best players rather than using part for squad players. Talking of cash, we are likely to also sell a few youngsters who don't quite fit Spurs for whatever reason - even one Caulker at 10m every year or two will make quite a difference, although most will go for less

So the next few TW's should be about looking at who's coming through the ranks as well as holes in the squad. Interesting times !

Spursidol · Sep 1, 2014

I'm still puzzled about the Kaboul situation :

1. His contract is thiught to expire at the end of this season - DL does not alow senior players to have less than 2 years left on their contract (as it means any sales value is much reduced), and this situation only arose as Kaboul was still injured last season

2. His general play so far this season has not been anything like as good as 2 seeasons ago - and generally still considered poor. Do the coaching/medical staff expect him to improve back to a high level anytime soon ?

3. Kaboul has captained te side several times this season

Is the captaincy some sort of attempt to persuade Kaboul to sign some srt of new contract ?

If he doesn't sign a new contract he will be eligible to talk tio new clubs in January. If this happens he leave in January - is this a reason for Dier's recruitment ?

I guess we'll know soon when a permanant captain is announced.

Spursidol · Sep 1, 2014

A few transfers to look out for :

CM In : Benjamin Stamboul from Momtpellier (conflicting twitter rumours as to whether a medical has happened or not) or Morgan S from Southampton (some ITK's still saying it could happen).

CM's out - Lewis Holtby (picture of him at Hamburg fc on twitter), Sandro (QPR, Napoli etc)

Youngsters out : Jonathan Obika - Swindon bound (finally ?)
Zeki Fryers ?

Wing Forwards - Welbeck or another in, possible exit of Lennon

Lots of rumours of Soldado going to replace Falcao - but unless we have another striker coming in, cannot see it as we would then be reduced to Adebayor (and he may go to ACN for 6 weelks) and the youthful Harry Kane as main striker

NEVILLEB · Sep 1, 2014

Two new defenders. Nice work.

I think we'll get MS

Spursidol · Sep 1, 2014

NEVILLEB said:
Two new defenders. Nice work.

I think we'll get MS

Odds against it - but that may be reason why we have not announced Benjamin Stamboul yet today )if one is being optimistic)

NEVILLEB · Sep 1, 2014

Sad we're having to leave our season to last minute gambles again but I guess I'm used to it.

Chelsea and Liverpool are showing the way. Great windows for them.

Spursidol · Sep 1, 2014

Major clearout - with Coulibally also going to Bari and Gomelt on a loan there too

Tottenham Hotspur ‏@SpursOfficial 16m
We have reached agreement with Swindon Town for the permanent transfer of Jonathan Obika. We wish him well. pic.twitter.com/1hRfAxDRtj

stemark44 · Sep 1, 2014

Spursidol said:
Major clearout - with Coulibally also going to Bari and Gomelt on a loan there too

Tottenham Hotspur ‏@SpursOfficial 16m
We have reached agreement with Swindon Town for the permanent transfer of Jonathan Obika. We wish him well. pic.twitter.com/1hRfAxDRtj

Never looked good enough to make it here but good luck to the lad.

stemark44 · Sep 1, 2014

I hope we make a bid for Fabien Delph,we need something different in midfield,too many similar players.

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