Jose Mourinho

walworthyid · Feb 5, 2021

dudu said:
I have managed a company too and been managed. I am almost certain the dynamic is absolutely nothing like that of the manager/player dynamic at a football club.

Im not arguing that Jose isn't failing at particular aspects of his job, he clearly is, but the players are failing at theirs too and I know for sure that in the first half last night, those not pulling their weight, moving for the ball showing for a pass were NOT following basic football instructions.

Jose isn't saying.... Serge, don't make space and move for a pass, Tanguy, just stroll around and don't bother pressing properly.

Yes, but the way we are set up makes it difficult to keep the ball. We are constantly under pressure in areas of the pitch that are compressed. If you look at the average position of our players, it is inevitable that when we get the ball it is going to be difficult to keep it. These things have to be coached and practiced. So often you look and there is nowhere for players to go.

Of course some of the players are to blame, but he wants to have 2 destroyers in the middle who have limited technical ability yet he is expecting them to receive the ball under pressure with limited options. When sissoko gets the ball where is he going other than sideways or backwards? Or Davies?

There were so many games under poch where we dominated the pitch but struggled to break teams down. It was side to side, slow recycling of the ball. But that is something you can work on. You have a position of strength. A tweak here or there can win a game. But this low block, passive nonsense is hopeless. You are constantly under pressure. You constantly hand the initiative to the opposition. The players can't play their way into having some confidence because they never get the bloody ball!

Yes the players have to take some responsibility, but ultimately the manager sets the team up. For me his tactics are outdated and negative.

He has got to go.

Seafordian Spurs · Feb 5, 2021

Everlasting Seconds said:
Defeated by Chelsea isn’t that big of a deal, since other teams we can compare ourselves with, such as Aston Villa, also lost. And lucky for us that Arsenal and Aston Villa play each other, so we can use that result to establish our claim to top 8.

Happy Friday, dude! ??

Typical Spurs · Feb 5, 2021

Wearegoingtowintheleague said:
Fair play to him.

I admire someone who holds their hands up, rather than just hides away for a while until things settle down.

I'm the same. Been very pro Jose and was convinced that making us hard to beat would be the way forward. But im really struggling.

I can't watch us playing like we're a league 1 team playing a Premier league team in the Cup each week.

Jose is very good at convincing you that we don't quite have the quality or players. However, Its the set up purely to negate the opposition that is the main problem. We are so focused on stopping the opposition that we don't know how attack other than to rely on Son and Kane.

Every other side you watch is very comfortable in possession and has a go. Please don't believe that we can't do that. We're not WBA or Burnley.

Just not good enough for me.

Gingernut · Feb 5, 2021

spurs-r-us said:
Lovely old school stuff there, but it doesn't wash anymore. They are doing their job, which is to play football and compete. If we want them to be motivated and be good at their job, we need the club leadership to come together and change whatever isn't working.

By your logic, football teams don't need managers because they're paid a lot of money so should just play well.

My word, you can't see the point I'm making. The issue isn't just the manager. Its both players and manager at fault.

In your example, manager shouldn't ask the guy to do spreadsheets all day but equally the employee shouldn't down tools and not do his job.

spursfan77 · Feb 5, 2021

hellava_tough said:
If we lose against the Baggies then he'll be on the brink.

Obvious to say, but ultimately if you're losing games you should be winning, the players aren't putting in the effort and key squad members are grumbling, then you're for the sack.

Simple as that really.

Yep. That’s why debating the what’s and wherefores are a bit pointless now. We are on the slope towards his sacking. I expect we will see a few reports of player unrest leaking out now just to speed things up. Although I think that won’t wash with a lot of fans because they aren’t going to forget 18 months ago when this group of players did the same thing to Poch.

The second half of this season could be a complete mess. Feels like it could go any number of ways wrong.

Wheeler Dealer · Feb 5, 2021

Gingernut said:
I'm fed up people not letting the players take some of the blame. Vast majority of the squad was the same players who let Poch down.

They didn't let Poch down, as in reality they were and are not good enough.

Gingernut · Feb 5, 2021

spurs-r-us said:
Lovely old school stuff there, but it doesn't wash anymore. They are doing their job, which is to play football and compete. If we want them to be motivated and be good at their job, we need the club leadership to come together and change whatever isn't working.

By your logic, football teams don't need managers because they're paid a lot of money so should just play well.

And do you really think they are competing???

Gingernut · Feb 5, 2021

Wheeler Dealer said:
They didn't let Poch down, as in reality they were and are not good enough.

Agreed. As they still aren't good enough now. Same players different managers...same results

Spunkmonkey · Feb 5, 2021

Gingernut said:
And do you really think they are competing????
And do you really think they are competing???

They are following the tactics which are set out by the manager, which are too drop deep don't engage the other team, and then look to counter. It looks like they're not competing, but that is the manager's preferred tactic.

With Kane and Son we attack in the opening 10 minutes to hope we get a goal up, then we retreat into our shell.

Without Kane we start off retreating then look to attack in the last 10 minutes in the vain hope of nicking something.

Seafordian Spurs · Feb 5, 2021

Jose is a problem but right now and likely into next season too whoever we get we're seeing us revert to type. A Europa levelish kind of team.

Ultimately you're only as good as the teams around you are shit and at the moment the EPL is stuffed with good teams, monied teams and well managed teams.

We'll be floundering for a while yet methinks.

But it doesn't mean we can't start planning for a Poch type mk 2 future.

Gingernut · Feb 5, 2021

Spunkmonkey said:
They are following the tactics which are set out by the manager, which are too drop deep don't engage the other team, and then look to counter. It looks like they're not competing, but that is the manager's preferred tactic.

With Kane and Son we attack in the opening 10 minutes to hope we get a goal up, then we retreat into our shell.

Without Kane we start off retreating then look to attack in the last 10 minutes in the vain hope of nicking something.

You know for a fact that's what he's telling them?

Oh Teddy Teddy · Feb 5, 2021

JUSTINSIGNAL said:
It's a damning indictment of Jose's coaching that we have next to no attacking threat when only 1 of our main attacking players is out injured.

I keep reading that the football was bad under Poch for the last year so. I'm sorry, none of it was ever as bad as some of the shit I've seen under Jose. Some of the cowardly passive crap I've seen under this manager leaves me in total despair. I feel like I'm self-harming at any other time except for the few seconds when Ndombele might do something, or we score a goal. The rest is just absolutely soulless shit.

I agree, and I don’t get the comparisons to Pochettino’s last year where it was clear he’d lost his passion for the job – though, as I understand it, his last 12 games took us 14 points; Jose’s has taken us 13. Useless, the lot of them

Spunkmonkey · Feb 5, 2021

Gingernut said:
You know for a fact that's what he's telling them?

I know for a fact that's what I'm seeing with my eyes.

It's happened game after game for it not to be the preferred tactics of the manager. I would take a look at his spell in charge of Manchester United as evidence.

Gingernut · Feb 5, 2021

Spunkmonkey said:
I know for a fact that's what I'm seeing with my eyes.

It's happened game after game for it not to be the preferred tactics of the manager. I would take a look at his spell in charge of Manchester United as evidence.

You still aren't there and don't know for sure? Trix has mentioned that the players have been seen to ignore the advise from the touchline during the game and sit too deep.

Deleted member 27995 · Feb 5, 2021

Spunkmonkey said:
I know for a fact that's what I'm seeing with my eyes.

It's happened game after game for it not to be the preferred tactics of the manager. I would take a look at his spell in charge of Manchester United as evidence.

Is this pre Sheffield United or after?

mrlilywhite · Feb 5, 2021

Gingernut said:
You know for a fact that's what he's telling them?

Facts from the mouth of Jose isn't needed - the proof is for your eyes. Do you need Pep or Klopp to tell you how their teams line up and play? No you don't, you can visually see it. Can you tell the difference when a team is playing with either a defensive system or an attacking one by how and where they are positioned on the pitch? Of course, you can - you don't need Jose to tell you how we are playing or how we play, the facts are there for all to see.

Spunkmonkey · Feb 5, 2021

Vinny_Sammways_left_peg said:
Is this pre Sheffield United or after?

One outlier against a team which hadn't won a game all season.

Gingernut · Feb 5, 2021

mrlilywhite said:
Facts from the mouth of Jose isn't needed - the proof is for your eyes. Do you need Pep or Klopp to tell you how their teams line up and play? No you don't, you can visually see it. Can you tell the difference when a team is playing with either a defensive system or an attacking one by how and where they are positioned on the pitch? Of course, you can - you don't need Jose to tell you how we are playing or how we play, the facts are there for all to see.

But they are ignoring advise from the touchline during games? See trix posts?

spurs mental · Feb 5, 2021

Spunkmonkey said:
They are following the tactics which are set out by the manager, which are too drop deep don't engage the other team, and then look to counter. It looks like they're not competing, but that is the manager's preferred tactic.

With Kane and Son we attack in the opening 10 minutes to hope we get a goal up, then we retreat into our shell.

Without Kane we start off retreating then look to attack in the last 10 minutes in the vain hope of nicking something.

Do you get access to the changing room often? Or is it Hotspur Way you go to?

Deleted member 27995 · Feb 5, 2021

Spunkmonkey said:
One outlier against a team which hadn't won a game all season.

Not interested in how bad or good they were - we're talking about the football on the pitch you're watching with your eyes.

Leeds?

The away game we lost at Liverpool after going one behind?

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