New Stadium Details And Discussions

Lighty64 · Jan 9, 2019

spursfan77 said:
£945

so if you go to every game this season in the league your paying the same price you would of in the New. are you in any special seats in Wembley and due to cost not where you want to be at the new stadium when it does open

Always Offside · Jan 9, 2019

It'd be interesting to get the truth about things once we're in and all the dust has settled. Did mace over-promise and under deliver ? Did the club leave room in the contract for Mace to not have to pay any damages for late delivery (unlikely I'm sure) ? Lots of questions.

Whatever the eventual outcome it doesn't help us now. No doubt Daniel is not happy & will handle things as need to be handled to ensure the stadium is delivered to the required standard as soon as possible.

2 years from now when we're playing Real Madrid or Barcelona in the Champions League 1/4 or semi final in front of 62000 fans it'll all be forgotten. (y)

spursfan77 · Jan 9, 2019

Lighty64 said:
so if you go to every game this season in the league your paying the same price you would of in the New. are you in any special seats in Wembley and due to cost not where you want to be at the new stadium when it does open

That’s it, same as everyone else, everyone is paying more for their seats at Wembley this season compared to the previous season.

Normal seat. Block 135 behind the goal.

Lighty64 · Jan 9, 2019

S17PUR said:
I'll tell you now, the first game at the new stadium will likely be in the first two weeks of April. That's because my wife's expecting our first baby on the 12th, and I won't be able to bloody go (to the stadium, I probably ought to attend the birth)!

if it's your 1st, a good chance it will be 2 weeks late anyway (y)

and the labour takes ages, plenty of time to head to a match 1st :whistle:

congrates

Darrenh61 · Jan 9, 2019

There are no liquidated damages in the mace contract, they would not agree them due to the incredibly tight timescale levy set out. They said they would deliver on time but would not financially guarantee meeting the deadline. The only chance of the club receiving any compensation is pursuing the sub contractors responsible for installation. This however can be highly speculative as generally sub contractors being that much of a smaller firm, have relatively small liability insurance policies in place. Suing them directly regardless of insurance is pretty pointless too as they won’t have the capital at hand to meet their liability and would be declared insolvent.

Cornpattbuck · Jan 9, 2019

coys200 said:
Today is the first time it’s really crossed my mind it could end up like another Wembley. They’ve had near on 6 months to sort the fire alarm stuff and don’t seem much closer to it being resolved.

If anything is reliable, it's your constantly baffling posts. Can't tell if you're a spoof account or not, so fair play. ?

Lighty64 · Jan 9, 2019

spursfan77 said:
That’s it, same as everyone else, everyone is paying more for their seats at Wembley this season compared to the previous season.

Normal seat. Block 135 behind the goal.

I'm sure there are quite a few that are buying tickets to go Wembley and it's worked out a fair bit cheaper than it has compared to the seats they have in the New Stadium. I'm sure I've seen post saying they got so much refund, and their ticket was a lot less

Well I can only hope that the Club do get something off of Mace and all those ST holders that have made the effort get something in return (I mean the 1's that have attended 75% at least of our home games)

at the moment the club is paying 2 to 3m per game compared to 20m for the whole season, they are losing out on roughly 12k attendance each week, on the corporative side they must be losing millions + merchandise, all this after 5 or 6 vastly improved contracts, and have the headache of the stadium.

coys200 · Jan 9, 2019

Cornpattbuck said:
If anything is reliable, it's your constantly baffling posts. Can't tell if you're a spoof account or not, so fair play. ?

We were promised a stadium opening in September. It’s been delayed month on month but still the blinkered believed it would be ready “next “month. The only 2 people that have been anywhere near accurate this whole debacle have been Kramer and Stacey. And Stacey has today outlined that the fire systems are still in a massive mess. Yet you think the possibility of the stadium still not being ready in 5 months is still completely out the question and “baffling”. Pretty sure people posted the same about me 5 months ago when I chose to believe Kramer. All I said was today is the first time it really dawned on me we could end up with a situation like Wembley. Given the shambles so far I really don’t see that as a ridiculous notion.

coys200 · Jan 9, 2019

If you want to chose to ignore this from a guy that has first hand info and been correct till now then fine your choice. But here he says August.

Lilbaz · Jan 10, 2019

coys200 said:
If you want to chose to ignore this from a guy that has first hand info and been correct till now then fine your choice. But here he says August. View attachment 44022 View attachment 44023

Fire alarms are an absolute pain in the arse at the best of times. Trying out a prototype panel seems madness. No-one not even the designer will be familiar with it and all it's quirks and foibles. Then you will probably have about 10 repeater panels that it will have to communicate with. Even long term fire panels that engineers have worked with for years throw up random shit. The amount of times i've rang the engineer and said the fire panels doing this and they've said "that's impossible it can't be doing that", then they turn up and say "fuck me, it shouldn't be doing that".

Why the fuck do they listen to the sales man who has little idea how the thing works in the first place?

Paolo10 · Jan 10, 2019

A massive fire alarm prototype panel sounds fucking awful, a family member is an alarm engineer and used to tell me stories about certain panels for systems that he literally hated.

Using a prototype (if true) is actually baffling to me for such a massive installation! (Maybe DL got it on the cheap to test it?! ?)

Hoopspur · Jan 10, 2019

So it’s not the wiring or sabotage now but the fire panels/system itself? Ahah, that’s cleared it all up.

tony0379 · Jan 10, 2019

Paolo10 said:
A massive fire alarm prototype panel sounds fucking awful, a family member is an alarm engineer and used to tell me stories about certain panels for systems that he literally hated.

Using a prototype (if true) is actually baffling to me for such a massive installation! (Maybe DL got it on the cheap to test it?! ?)

Maybe he got it down Monkey Harris's auction

Tiffers · Jan 10, 2019

spursfan77 said:
I paid £695 for my season ticket at Wembley last season. To sit in the same seat this season it’s costing me £945 (if we were to remain at Wembley for the whole season). I know there’s a whole load of variables, and I can see why a lot of people would be annoyed. They should really be charging us the same as we paid last season if they were being really fair.

Hopefully the club can sue MACE (or whoever is truely to blame) for damages and get some money back. I bet they won’t then be passing some of it onto the fans though!

The other thing that really pisses me off is having to buy a ticket for each and every game i want to see at Wembley. I have a season ticket precisely because I want to know I have a ticket for each game and can just turn up with my card and get in. Why, having paid up front for my season ticket, do I have to keep checking (a) the on the sale dates (b) trying to remember the individual day they go on sale (c) sit in front of my computer in a bloody queue waiting to buy my ticket ( afraid to do anything else on the computer in case I lose my place in the queue) and (d) pay twice for the same game even though I do get a refund for one later on. This rant does not include the extra time it take me to get to Wembley and that f.....g long steep walk up Olympic Way.

S17PUR · Jan 10, 2019

Lighty64 said:
if it's your 1st, a good chance it will be 2 weeks late anyway and the labour takes ages, plenty of time to head to a match 1st

congrates

Sadly I live in Merseyside, so it's a solid 4.5 or 5 hour drive home! This was also likely to be my last year as a ST holder, as I've been doing it for 13 years and the travelling kicks my ass (plus I should probably spend some time with the aforementioned child). So, I'm definitely with Poch in that we need to move as soon as it's ready!

vegassd · Jan 10, 2019

coys200 said:
We were promised a stadium opening in September. It’s been delayed month on month but still the blinkered believed it would be ready “next “month. The only 2 people that have been anywhere near accurate this whole debacle have been Kramer and Stacey. And Stacey has today outlined that the fire systems are still in a massive mess. Yet you think the possibility of the stadium still not being ready in 5 months is still completely out the question and “baffling”. Pretty sure people posted the same about me 5 months ago when I chose to believe Kramer. All I said was today is the first time it really dawned on me we could end up with a situation like Wembley. Given the shambles so far I really don’t see that as a ridiculous notion.

I think the "baffling" part was about some of your posts, not the potential opening time of the stadium.

Where stuff like this quickly gets out of hand is with the use of phrases like "we were promised", "the blinkered believed" and "the shambles so far". It makes the poster sound like they are stomping around a room, shouting and screaming whilst throwing items of crockery at the walls!

Earlier in the week I found an interesting thread about the stadium on a forum for architects/engineers and those who generally like the construction industry. There are a few familiar names over there so clearly I'm not the only SC member to wander in:
https://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=549397&page=4102

Some good stuff in there from people who (seemingly) know what they're talking about. There appears to be a consensus that in terms of the safety systems Mace have done exactly what they should have - catching the problems before the official tests were taking place and moving to resolve them. The post at the top of that link has particular information about the testing of the safety system. There are no shouts of "sabotage" or "incompetence" from the well-informed throughout the thread.

Unfortunately the thread got shut down because the Spurs fans over there had posted enough BS that they got fed up with it all. So that puts paid to getting any new information from insiders or industry commentators. With that in mind, and considering that very few of us truly know what we're talking about when it comes to commercial construction projects, it might be a good idea to turn the rhetoric down a bit.

Ranting about stuff isn't going to get us in any quicker.Throwing baseless allegations around isn't going to get us in any quicker. Waiting to hear an update that matches what you said 5 months ago then proclaiming that you were right all along isn't going to get us in any quicker. The delays are hugely disappointing for all of us but let's not (any of us) pretend than we have a proper handle on what is going on.

spursfan77 · Jan 10, 2019

This guy’s timeline has turned into a tale of dispair now regarding the fire system.

coys200 · Jan 10, 2019

vegassd said:
I think the "baffling" part was about some of your posts, not the potential opening time of the stadium.

Where stuff like this quickly gets out of hand is with the use of phrases like "we were promised", "the blinkered believed" and "the shambles so far". It makes the poster sound like they are stomping around a room, shouting and screaming whilst throwing items of crockery at the walls!

Earlier in the week I found an interesting thread about the stadium on a forum for architects/engineers and those who generally like the construction industry. There are a few familiar names over there so clearly I'm not the only SC member to wander in:
https://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=549397&page=4102

Some good stuff in there from people who (seemingly) know what they're talking about. There appears to be a consensus that in terms of the safety systems Mace have done exactly what they should have - catching the problems before the official tests were taking place and moving to resolve them. The post at the top of that link has particular information about the testing of the safety system. There are no shouts of "sabotage" or "incompetence" from the well-informed throughout the thread.

Unfortunately the thread got shut down because the Spurs fans over there had posted enough BS that they got fed up with it all. So that puts paid to getting any new information from insiders or industry commentators. With that in mind, and considering that very few of us truly know what we're talking about when it comes to commercial construction projects, it might be a good idea to turn the rhetoric down a bit.

Ranting about stuff isn't going to get us in any quicker.Throwing baseless allegations around isn't going to get us in any quicker. Waiting to hear an update that matches what you said 5 months ago then proclaiming that you were right all along isn't going to get us in any quicker. The delays are hugely disappointing for all of us but let's not (any of us) pretend than we have a proper handle on what is going on.

Somebody called my post “baffling”. Which is basically the same that was said about me when I believed Kramer 5 months ago. I had every right to defend myself. And right now I’d say “shambles” is a pretty spot on adjective to define the situation. I’m not a person that calls out other people’s accounts. But when I’m called out I have every to defend myself especially as the person I sided with was correct.

'O Zio · Jan 10, 2019

kmk said:
Didn't Wembley open ahead of schedule?

You must be joking? It was an absolute disaster miles worse than our new stadium. The initial plan was supposed to be started in 2000/2001 and finished in 2003 but they didn't even start working on it until late 2002. It eventually opened in 2007 so was about 4 years late relative to the initial plan, or perhaps more fairly, 2 years late in terms of the revised timescale after the started work on it.

On top of that it also cost pretty much triple what it was supposed to in the end and there's still all sorts of legal cases ongoing between the various contractors all blaming each other for their massive losses on the project. It's got to be one of the most disastrous stadium constructions there's ever been. And all that for a stadium that most people would say is absolutely awful if you ignore the "but it's Wembley, the home of football!" bullshit.

No idea where you've got the opening ahead of schedule thing from mate.

Tucker · Jan 10, 2019

'O Zio said:
You must be joking? It was an absolute disaster miles worse than our new stadium. The initial plan was supposed to be started in 2000/2001 and finished in 2003 but they didn't even start working on it until late 2002. It eventually opened in 2007 so was about 4 years late relative to the initial plan, or perhaps more fairly, 2 years late in terms of the revised timescale after the started work on it.

On top of that it also cost pretty much triple what it was supposed to in the end and there's still all sorts of legal cases ongoing between the various contractors all blaming each other for their massive losses on the project. It's got to be one of the most disastrous stadium constructions there's ever been. And all that for a stadium that most people would say is absolutely awful if you ignore the "but it's Wembley, the home of football!" bullshit.

No idea where you've got the opening ahead of schedule thing from mate.

Yeah I remember Wembley going way over schedule and budget. My ex had booked tickets to see Robbie bloody Williams there, and we ended up going to Milton Keynes to see him. Fun times :cautious:

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